Lebanese POWs - Israel's dirty little secret
Samir al-Qintar is a PoW languishing in an Israeli prison for the last 28 years, and - brace yourself - he was 16 years old when he was captured (i.e., kidnapped).
The following excerpt is from a letter dated 11 February 1999 from the Permanent Representative of Lebanon to the United Nations, addressed to the Secretary-General.
Trials [in Israel] are purely pro forma, and there is no difference between those tried, those who have served their sentences and those being held without trial. All of them are hostages.What are their crimes?
By its decision of 13 November 1997, the Supreme Court of Israel acknowledged that the Lebanese detainees are hostages and are a bargaining chip.
That Israel has enshrined hostage-taking and torture in its laws is a flagrant violation of international law and sets a precedent that is the first of its kind in the world. It has never before happened in all of history that a court of justice has sanctioned the taking of hostages. Some detainees were not tried following their abduction, and they are languishing in prisons that the International Committee of the Red Cross is forbidden to enter and are not allowed to exchange letters with their families.* * *[al-Qintar] is the longest serving Lebanese prisoner in the Israeli prison system, having been placed in detention for life on 22 April 1979. He is not allowed to meet with his family or his brothers despite the fact that it is 20 years since he was first arrested. Most of the detainees endure difficult physical and mental conditions since their families are prevented from visiting them and they live in complete isolation from the world.
The charges made against detainees can be summarized as follows:What say you, America? Guilty as charged?(a) Resistance to the Israeli occupation;
(b) Refusal to enlist in the militias collaborating with Israel;
(c) Refusal to pay duties and taxes;
(d) Dealing with the Lebanese Government and providing information to the Lebanese Army;
(e) Possession of cell phones;
(f) Refusing Israeli assistance and the organization of tourist visits to Israel.
Or, is it time to put Israel on trial?
posted by Unknown @ Sunday, July 23, 2006
23 Comments:
This is disastrous! I had no idea. Thanks, Akber, for bringing this to light!
BTW, I hope you don't mind I plucked a few additional quotes from the source and added it to your post (among other things).
This dirty little secret must be circulated far and wide! And they call themselves a democracy! What a farce!
Time to put Israel on trial? What crooked Jew lawyer should I hire? This is not a crooked Jew lawyer joke...why is no-one laughing?
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Not at all - feel free. It was late at night for me.
This is the face of perverted Zionism, that is now just racism and inhumanity. Bring out the names of the Lebanese PoWs. Any place I can get them?
It is partly our fault. If we don't publicize this inhumanity, all we will hear is Shalit, Shalit, Shalit, Shalit.
I'm glad to see someone posting the truth.
I'm using the stuff you post,to spread the truth.
Keep up the good work.
The truth about Zionists is that:
1. They have always been RACIST!
2. They have always been ANTI-SEMITIC!
3. And they have FOREVER been jealous that the Arab people have more "semetic" blood than they do!
I hate their brutality and superiority over all mankind. They are not just after the Arabs, they are after ALL of us. They want the planet for themselves. The threat is very real and the Zionist dream has now become the most perverse reality in our generation.
Thank you for that information. The more I learn the more horrified I become. Not only at what is occuring but how it is being allowed to occur and how the majority of people just don't care at all.
They care about the price of petrol and as far as the Middle East goes that's about it. I guess all those warnings about too much TV turning your brain to mush where true.
Check this out: AIPAC v. Norman Finkelstein: A Debate on Israel's Assault on Gaza
Please everyone - go The French Connection and listen to what Daryl Bradford Smith and his guests have to say on Zionism. One very important person to hear is Christopher Jon Bjerknes, an independent researcher, that eloquently, but adamantly explains the Zionist plan, not just for the Arabs but for the entire world. This includes the U.S.! The French Connection has all the documents to corroborate the information. Everything is free to copy. Download the MP3's or Podcasts and share them with your friends and family. It is more important than ever to get this information out NOW!
The French Connection
You wrote: "Samir al-Qintar is a PoW languishing in an Israeli prison for the last 28 years, and - brace yourself - he was 16 years old when he was captured (i.e., kidnapped)"
The reality is quite different. In 1979, Quntar crossed into northern Israel from Lebanon, and took Danny Haran and his four-year-old daughter, Einat, as hostages, to bring them to Lebanon. When the Israeli army arrived, Quntar murdered Danny and Einat. Danny's other daughter also died in the attack...
^^ Liar.
What Igor Perchesky says seems to be verifiable. He is in prison primarily because he is a murderer.
Am I wrong?
A simple google search on samir qantar or qintar willl show it up.
That's strange. My understanding is that he was in jail for raiding a family's home as they slept and later shooting the father and smashing their 4 year old daughter's face with a rifle butt (thus killing her too).
Is it so hard to believe those "dirty zionists" as the previous poster called them would want to keep a guy like that in jail?
Here's the Washinton Post article about it. There are lots of others if anyone bothers to do their own research instead of just taking your word for it.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A2740-2003May17¬Found=true
I meant to add this to the previous message.
I realize the article I posted is one sided, but the point is you're better off hearing both sides of an issue and making up your own mind than listening to this divel alone. Even if both happen to be a bit extreme, you can generally assume the truth is in the middle somewhere.
And like I said, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH.
Everyone should do their own research.
But...
"you can generally assume the truth is in the middle somewhere."
is PURE DRIVEL.
Israelis admit that they lie regularly.
If you can assume anything, it's that Israelis are lying.
I am noticing that you guys are speaking about Samir Quntar, who is indeed, the longest held Lebanese prisoner in Israeli custody. Quntar has been jailed in Israeli prison for almost 30 years!
Instead of you guys blaming Israel and spreading lies that "Israel is holding him illegally," or “that he is Israel’s dirty little secret (because they have been holding him for so long),” or “that he didn’t commit any crime to deserve this punishment” is utter bullshit! Quntar is jailed in Israel for committing one of the most sickest horrific crime ever committed on Israeli soil. Lets put it this way, any sane society would have already executed Quntar, and it is unbelievable Israel is still feeding him and giving him humane care in prison! Please read the following text below, to learn the TRUTH about Samir Quntar (also spelled Kuntar, Qantar, Kantar, Kintar):
Courtesy of http://SamirKuntar.net
Samir Kuntar
سمير القنطار
CONFESSED CHILD KILLER!
On July 12, 2006 Lebanese Hezbollah terrorists crossed the border with Israel in an operation dubbed "Operation Truthful Promise," which was aimed at nabbing Israeli soldiers in exchange for Lebanese prisoners. Hezbollah succeeded in the operation and successfully took hostage two Israeli soldiers, Eldad Regev and Ehud Goldwasser. During the operation, eight Israeli soldiers were killed. This ignited the sequence of events which led to the Israel/Lebanon summer war.
The story goes further back than July of 2006. It really began in April 1979! On Sabbath day, April 22, 1979, Danny and Smadar Haran met up with a monster named Samir Kuntar.
Danny and Smadar were a loving Israeli couple. They had everything they could ever hope for... love, marriage and two precious daughters, Einat, 4 and Yael, 2. That day Smadar was home anticipating Danny's return from work and preparing for the Sabbath. She had just picked up their two toddlers from day care. Danny, on the other hand, was looking forward to nothing more than getting home and spending time with his wife and his two young daughters.
Traditionally, the Sabbath is the most special day of the week, the day the family gets to spend time together and celebrate their bond to Judaism. It was especially important for Danny who, as a young father, had to work extra hard in order to provide for his wife and young children. Little did Smadar know that this would be the last Sabbath she would celebrate with her family because of a man named Samir Kuntar. Around midnight the nightmare began!
Who is Samir Kuntar?
Samir Kuntar is one of three Lebanese prisoners still serving time in Israeli jails. Kuntar, a Lebanese Druze born on July 20, 1962 in the Lebanese mountain village of Aabey currently holds the dubious distinction of being the longest held Lebanese prisoner in Israeli jails! He was a member of Abu Abbas' notorious PLF (Palestine Liberation Front) which committed despicable acts of terror against Israeli, Jewish, and American targets worldwide throughout the 1970's and 1980's. Kuntar was convicted and sentenced to a 534 years prison sentence by the state of Israel. Israel even almost tried to pass a bill to have him executed! What did he do? What was his crime?
The Nasser Operation
The crime he committed was the most horrific crime ever committed on Israeli soil! On April 22, 1979 Samir Kuntar along with a gang of three other PLF terrorists (Abed Majeed Asslan, Ahmed Al-Abras, and Mhanna Salim Al- Muyaed) departed from the southern Lebanese seashore city of Tyre on a 55-horsepowered rubber motor boat. Their destination was the Israeli coastal city of Naharyia, about 10 km south of the Lebanese border, the target of their operation was a residential apartment building. This operation was dubbed "Nasser Operation" and its aim was the killing and terrorizing of Israel's Jewish civilians.
The terrorists made landfall in the Israeli coastal city of Naharyia at around midnight, undetected under the cover of darkness. As they made their way along the shore, they were intercepted by an Israeli police officer whom they shot dead. In Naharya the terrorists broke into a building as other Israeli police officers arrived on the scene. The terrorists then broke into Danny and Smadar Haran's apartment, fired their weapons and threw grenades. Smadar managed to find a crawl space into which she, her younger daughter, 2 year old Yael, and a neighbor all hid. To prevent Yael from crying and giving away their hiding place, Smadar covered the child's mouth with her hand.
According to Smadar "They held Danny and Einat while they searched for me and Yael, knowing there were more people in the apartment. I will never forget the joy and the hatred in their voices as they swaggered about hunting for us, firing their guns and throwing grenades. I knew that if Yael cried out, the terrorists would toss a grenade into the crawl space and we would be killed. So I kept my hand over her mouth, hoping she could breathe. As I lay there, I remembered my mother telling me how she had hidden from the Nazis during the Holocaust. 'This is just like what happened to my mother,' I thought."
Sadly, Smadar's attempt to muffle her daughter's whimpering proved fatal. Yael was accidentally suffocated and died within the hiding space.
According to Smadar Haran, her last memories of Danny and Einat, that day, were when they were being led away at gun point by Kuntar. She could hear from her closet space Danny telling Einat, "Don't be scared, my baby, it will be alright" and Einat replied to him in her little voice, "Dad, where is Mommy? I want Mommy." Smadar's last memory of her 2-year-old daughter, Yael, was when her little daughter was taken to the apartment hiding space. Right before Yael had her mouth covered by her mother, she asked her mother "Where is my little pacifier." There was no time to search for the pacifier. Minutes later Smadar covered Yael's mouth to keep her from revealing the hiding space. Smadar soon felt her daughter's tiny tongue licks and lip sucking on the palm of her hand. She didn't know what to make of it at first but hours later was told by doctors and paramedics that the reason Yael was licking her palm while she covered her mouth was because she was gasping for air.
After taking Danny and four-year old Einat hostage, Kuntar and his group took them down to the beach. Samir Kuntar quickly shot Danny in the back and then drowned him in the Mediterranean Sea to ensure his death. While Kuntar drowned Danny, he forced terrified Einat to watch and cry. According to eyewitnesses, "Danny was murdered in front of Einat so that his death would be the last sight she would ever see." Little Einat would not have that horrible memory in her head for long. Kuntar, the brave Lebanese freedom fighter, crushed Einat's skull over and over upon the rocks with the butt of his rifle until she was dead.
During the ensuing shootout between Kuntar's terror group and Israeli police, two policeman were killed along with two of the Arab terrorists. Kuntar and the fourth participant, Ahmed Al-Abrass, were captured. Ahmed Al-Abrass was later free by the Israeli authorities in the infamous May 1985 Ahmed Jibril prisoner exchange deal in which 1,150 Arab prisoners (some of whom had blood on their hands) were exchanged for three Israeli soldiers. Kuntar was not included in the deal.
The Israeli government determined at first to make a decision to execute Kuntar, for his horrific crime, especially for the fact that he tortured and beat to death the 4-year old toddler. Israeli Prime Minister at that time, Menachem Beagin , proposed a draft resolution to the Security and Foreign Affairs Committee in the Israeli Keenest on April 24, 1979. He demanded to eliminate a previous resolution stipulated by the Israeli cabinet, which said no execution should be implemented against terrorists as the international law prohibits it. The Israeli Foreign Minister Izer Weizman and Transportation Minister Hayeem Landau supported Beagins draft resolution. Abraham Sharer, who was the head of the Likude parliamentary bloc also, called for Kuntars execution. Isaac Shamir issued a statement on April 25, 1979 also calling for his execution.
Kuntar flashing the victory sign while being sentenced
by an Israeli court. File photo from Israeli newspaper
The Israelis tried to implement the execution sentence on Samir Kuntar and the whole parliament agreed on them. The only dilemma they were having was the Israeli law that doesnt allow execution except for the Nazis of the World War II and to those found guilty of betrayal to their country. Furthermore, they did not want the international community on their backs; also, they wanted to improve their relationship with Egypt after the peace process. As a consequence, the Israeli central court in Haifa sentenced Kuntar to 5 life sentences plus 47 years to come up with the total of 542 years. During the trial, Kuntar was waving victory signs, and called himself a hero.
Samir Kuntar has confessed proudly to his murder of the little girl and never once showed one ounce of remorse for his crime. Even while serving his prison term, he has bragged repeatedly during interviews about how proud he was for murdering the 4-year-old Israeli child. While in prison Kuntar got married and even receives conjugal visits. Below he stands proudly alongside other convicted Arab murderer, Marwan Barghouti.
Several months later, the PLF seized the Achille Lauro, an Italian cruise ship, and demanded that Israel release Kuntar along with a list of 50 other Palestinian prisoners. Ironically out of the 50 Arab Palestinian prisoners that were demanded, Kuntar was the ONLY one that was "actually" named on that list. The hijackers killed a wheelchair-bound American Jewish passenger, Leon Klinghoffer, and threw him overboard into the Mediterranean Sea. Kuntar was not released, but his supporters would not give up. In 2004 Israel release ALL Lebanese prisoners except for Kuntar and two other Lebanese (Nissim Nasser and Yehya Sakaf). In fact Kuntar, as well, was almost released by Israel during that infamous Israel Hezbollah Prisoner Exchange of 2004, BUT in the last second Hezbollah violated the agreement and Kuntar remained behind bars!
War: July 12, 2006
On July 12, 2006 per orders of Hezbollah leader, Sheik Hasssan Nasrallah, Hezbollah terrorists crossed the northern Israeli border. They attacked two Israeli military vehicles with anti tank missiles, killed four soldiers, kidnapped two others and demanded the immediate unconditional release of Samir Kuntar in exchange for the two abducted soldiers. Hezbollah originally named this operation "Operation Freedom for Samir Al-Kuntar," but on the days leading up to the July 12 attack it was shortened to "Operation Truthful Promise." The latter referred to the "true promise" Nasrallah had made to the Kuntar family that the cross-border kidnapping of IDF soldiers to force the release of Samir Kuntar.
In subsequent interviews on Al-Manar TV station Dr Mohamad Jawad Khalifeh, the Lebanese Minster of Health, congratulated Hezbollah for "its great actions" and said that "Lebanon has the right to regain its prisoners and liberate them." Ali Ammar, an Hezbollah member of the Lebanese Parliament, stated his opinion that "particularly at this basic stage in the history of the homeland and the nation, this government should have expressed solidarity with its people and let Samir Quntar feel that he is a Lebanese par excellence."
As expected, the Israeli government was not interested in negotiating with terrorists. They sent a small number of troops into southern Lebanon in an attempt to quickly find and free their two soldiers. Soon Hezbollah began shelling Israel's northern communities with Katuysha rockets in an attempt to kill as many innocent men, women and children as possible and to pressure the Israeli government to take the prisoner exchange demand. Israel had no choice but to escalate their response. Both Hezbollah, their supporters and Lebanon's civil infrastructure all suffered the consequences. Even though Israel defeated Hezbollah during this war, it still didn't manage to get its soldiers back.
During the fighting Israel captured a Hezbollah terrorist by the name of Ali Hassan Saliman. In the interviews/interrogations following his capture, Saliman said that the main objective of Hezbollah's corss-border kidnapping of two Israeli soldiers was to secure the release of Samir Kuntar. Also, that Nasrallah had made a promise to the Kuntar family that Samir would be released. The Hezbollah operation was first and foremost aimed at releasing Kuntar. Everything else was secondary.
Israel's track record of going against it's previous policy of not releasing Arab prisoners with blood on their hands in exchange for IDF soldiers has come home to roost. Arab terrorist groups have been encouraged to kidnap Israelis in the hope (and often the expectation) that these soldiers will become bargaining chips for the release of Arab prisoners. This softening of Israel's formerly strict policy of never negotiating with terrorists has merely added fuel to the fire. Israeli soldiers are supposed to protect the children of Israel, not to facilitate the release of child murderers, such as the monster, Samir Kuntar.
Neither Israelis individually nor their military intentionally targets children or any non-combatant, for that matter. When children die, it is nearly always because they are caught in the crossfire or when they are "set up" by their fellow Arab-terrorists to score propaganda points. But NEVER would manner of the killing be so pre-planned nor would the act itself be so glorified, such as that as Samir Kuntar.
Smadar Haran has since remarried and is raising a new family. She hopes that Samir Kuntar will stay behind bars until his dying day. "I don't believe that the terrorist will be released now, and I don't believe that the Israeli government will accept this request, after it promised not to release terrorists with blood on their hands."
We at SamirKuntar.net concur with Smadar Haran. We will do whatever we can to see that Samir Kuntar rots in Israeli prisons. We would also urge the Israeli government and courts to reverse the long-standing policy of not allowing for the administration of the death sentence. After all, Samir Kuntar and other Samir Kuntars like him never thought twice about administrating the death sentence to little Einat Haran and other Einat Harans just like her!
CONCLUSION
Kuntar was not the reason Israel chose to go to war with Lebanon but he was the reason Hezbollah kidnapped the two soldiers which set the war process in motion.
POSTSCRIPT
Neither Israel nor Hezbollah doubt that Kuntar murdered Danny and Einat Haran. The only difference is that Israel sees him as the cold-blooded murderer he is. Hezbollah and their supporters glorify him as a freedom fighter and hero!
There is another point worth mentioning. Hezbollah has never claimed that Kuntar was innocent or that he may have been framed. They only demand his release as if he were being held unlawfully and that Israel had no right to imprison him. Once again it's all about Israel never doing any right and Arabs incapable of doing any wrong!
A Sad Gruesome Reality.....
After drowning Danny in the sea in front of little Einat, Kuntar, the brave Lebanese freedom fighter, then turned his attention towards the frightened little 4-year old. He took his rifle and then swung it across the little toddler's head, knocking her to the ground. As little Einat was knocked to the ground, she was screaming and crying hysterically "mommy daddy help me," while thrashing her little legs around in the sand. But unfortunately Einat was alone, and no one was there to save her. Kuntar then dragged the little toddler a couple of feet to the closest rock he could find, this was while she was begging him not to hurt her. Kuntar, then laid her head down on a rock, with the intention of crushing it with the butt of his rifle. Einat, instinctively covered her head with her little arms, Kuntar struggled with the little toddler until he finally managed to clear her arms out of the way so that he could aim for the head, and then he proceeded on beating her over and over with the butt of his rifle until blood rushed out of her ears and her little cries faded away as she was knocked into unconsciousness. Then, to ensure she was dead, Kuntar continued on beating her over the head, as hard as he could, several more times until her skull was crushed and she was dead.
ARTICLES AND REFERENCES
Israel moots Kuntar prisoner swap
(AL-JAZEERA 9/17/2006)
Free the monster Samir Kuntar
(Haaretz article 09/04/2006)
Plot to free terrorist (Kuntar) may have led to fight
(Washington Times 8/8/2006)
Nasrallah says no deal without Samir
(9/12/2006 BBC article "Nasrallah Demands Militant Free")
"Hizballah Wants Israel to Free Child-Killer"
(Cybercast News Service, 7/18/2006)
More than 25 years later, militant still atop Hezbollah's list for swap
(Seattle Times 8/16/2006)
Why Hezbollah Attacked Israel
(Mens News Daily 8/09/2006)
Samir Kuntar to be released very soon
The Jerusalem Post 1/6/2007
In fact, the Israeli government was stupid enough, to 'almost' release Quntar in 2004. But in the last second Hezbollah violated the agreement and Quntar remained behind bars (where he belongs)!
Please read article below, to learn more (Samir Quntar. also spelled Kuntar, Qantar, Kantar, Kintar):
Courtesy of: http://samirkuntar.net/samir2.html
Negotiations: Arab-Israeli Style
One Missing Airman
Three Executed Soldiers
Four Hundred Arab Terrorists
And a Lop-Sided 2004 Prisoner Exchange
In 1982, after enduring years of murderous Arab terrorist attacks across its northern border, the Israel Defense Forces invaded Lebanon. During the war, Israeli airman, Ron Arad, was shot down by the Amal Shi'ite. He has been held in captivity to this very day. No one knows of his whereabouts or his fate. Israel's demand for his release or for information about his condition have been met with silence, Israel even offered a ten million dollar reward for information of his whereabouts but to no avail.
Eight long years later in May of 2000 Israel withdrew from Lebanon. Israel hoped that Lebanon would stabilize itself and keep the Lebanese-Israeli border peaceful. This was not the case. In September 2000 Hezbollah terrorists captured 3 Israeli (Adi Avitan, Beni Avraham, and Omar Sawaid ) soldiers and demanded that Israel release all Lebanese prisoners currently held. Israel refused to negotiate and Hezbollah responded by murdering all three soldiers.
That very same week Hezbollah kidnapped Israeli civilian, Elhanan Tennenbaum and demanded all Lebanese prisoners be released in two phases. During the first phase, Israel was to release all Lebanese prisoners with "no blood on their hands" (well, maybe those without too much blood on their hands!) along with a significant number of Palestinians prisoners. In total, 23 Lebanese Arabs and 400 Palestinian Arabs living prisoners were exchanged for the the bodies of the three very dead soldiers plus the businessman, Elhanan Tennebaum. The second phase would have freed Samir Kuntar in exchange merely for information as to the fate of missing Israeli airman, Ron Arad.
With regard to the second phase of the deal, Hezbollah "agreed" in words but failed to deliver in deed. They simply sent a box of bones claiming they were the remains of Ron Arads. After extensive DNA-testing of the bones, they found out they were not Arad's! [Knowing the cruelty for which terrorists are renown, the bones may have been that of a goat!] Israel was no longer obligated to do her part of the second phase. There would be no release of the prisoners [Palestinian Arab] Samir Kuntar, and [Arab Lebanese] Nissim Nasser (who was a spy for Hezbollah) and Yihiye Sakaf (who participated in the Coastal Road Massacre in which 38 Israeli civilians were killed).
Everything was quiet until July 12, 2006.
Articles and References:
Bones sent to Israel by Hezbollah are not Ron Arad's (Haaretz 02/02/2004)
Lebanese newspaper: Ron Arad's bones examined by Israel (Haaretz, 05/13/2004)
Biography of Ron Arad (Ron Arad's official Website)
This comment has been removed by the author.
Cut and paste link below into the url engine, to watch youtube video of Arab prisoners in Israeli jails:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x-P7a8vHt8
why should we believe anything you say?
israelis are habitual liars and your story is entirely hearsay.
for all I know, your story was fabricated from start to finish and it wouldn't be the first time an israeli made up stories of israeli victimhood.
Qantar also raped the little, he didnt only beat her to death. But he sexually molested her too.
.
Kuntar isn't allowed to see his family?! WHAT A CROCK OF RUBBISH!
Kuntar was able to get visits in jail. He was able to meet a woman, court her and MARRY HER while incarcerated.
Not only that - he was able to get an education, almost completing a Masters Degree at the expense of the "Great Satan"...
Arabs are tried in a fair trial. They are often aquitted, they get lawyers and if they cannot afford them, they are appointed. The trials are ANYTHING BUT Kangaroo Courts. Arab Israelis are JUDGES in these courts, there is even an Arab Israeli SUPREME COURT JUDGE (how that fits with your absurd little lies I don't know... So much for the APartheid theory then!)
You're list of crimes is absolutely false. Arabs are in jail for MURDER, and/or MASS MURDER like Marwan Barghouti, the admitted killer of MANY INNOCENTS as head of the Al Aqsa MArtyr's Brigades. The are in jail for aiding and abetting in terror operations such as hiding or sewing suicide belts. They are in prison for lying to get into Israel, the only place that will give them jobs (lest we forget, for all the Arabs yipyap, no Arab nation provides the Palis with water, electricity, jobs...Israel does this). They are also in prison for theft, burglary and defiling holy sites, not to mention several other crimes (There are many, but you're list is absurd)...
Care to debate (Respectfully)?
Visit us at Wingless 8
why should we believe anything you say?
israelis are habitual liars and your story is entirely hearsay.
Yep, and they have tails, and they eat Palestinian children for passover.
You're debating skills are simply amazing. What intellect, what reason, what logic. You sure have convinced me...
Your defence is almost (ALMOST!) as good as the "I know you are but what am I" defence, coined by the learn'd and wise Sheik Pee-Wee Abu Herman
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