< HOME  Sunday, June 11, 2006

“I saw my sister and her head was gone.”

Nothing Israel says can begin to explain why this carnage took place.

"We were just playing in the sea. I know how to swim and we had all joined hands in a circle and were swimming and playing."

She goes on to describe the explosions that hit the family as they gathered their possessions and waited by a sandy beach road for a taxi to take them home.

"The first missile didn't hit me," she said. "I was only hit afterwards."

* * *

As far as Hadil Ghalia's brother Ayham, 20, can remember, the shell came from the sea.

* * *

"While we were on the beach we heard Israel launching missiles elsewhere, so we gathered our things and called the taxi," he said. "Suddenly the missile just landed right on us.

"My father was beside me, and his stomach was cut wide open and his guts were spilling out. I thought only he was hit, and I was calling to him but he did not answer.

"Then I looked around and saw the others. Some had their arms hanging off. I saw my sister and her head was gone," he said, referring to 15-year-old Elham, who was decapitated in the blast. Another sister, Reham, 16, is recovering in hospital where she has had both arms amputated.

It sounds like a horror movie. But, this is life in Gaza.
Despite his grief, Ayham talks without rancour about Israel, and says he hopes that Palestinians and Israelis "can sit together and come to peace".

Unfortunately, these are not the acts of a nation that wants peace.

This cannot go on much longer.


At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger The Sociologist said...

This is appalling. Unfortunately this will probably not reach most people's TV sets in the U.S.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger tomtom said...

However it reached the European TV sets. Appaling is even to soft in expression. I have lost all symphaty to the Israeli state.

TomTom, fearless navigator

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

Fearful Tom,

If the Palestinians want to avoid this in the future, they can easily stop firing rockets into Israel. Then accidents like this won't happenm, as Israel won't have to defend itself, because there won't be anything to defend against.

It is so simple, isn't it?

Must be why you didn't think of it. ;-)

Cops sometimes kill innocents while they aim for felons. Guess what? Legally, the death of that innocent is on the fleeing felon. It's called FELONY MURDER. QRS must be aware of this, studying for the bar and all.

Legally, the deaths of the Palestinian civilians fall into that definition. I blame the Palestinians. Felony murder, pure and simple.

And I have no sympathy for a law school graduate who should know the law and chooses to ignore it, and instead spreads hate on her website.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Erosoplier said...

Better that her hate gets put on her website than kept in her heart, miss r. Better than using guns and bombs to express her hate.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...


Spreading hate like this on the internet ferments rage - until someone decides to use guns and bombs rather than words.

You should know this, as a hater of Jews yourself who quotes passages from the Protocols of Zion and believes Israel is behind 9/11.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

One a side note: So now miss r. is defending the pigs. Hmm so I suppose when in Denver the pigs came into a house and shot an innocent man holding a soda can it wasn't there fault. After all if I see someone holding a soda and am too stupid to tell the difference between a soda can and a gun I guess I should just shoot too. Oh and by the way you should note, it is usually the same pigs who do the same killings over and over again.

Back to the topic: It is so sad what happens. Even sader is that the SUV liberals and Democult just like the rethugs refuse to even acknowledge these people as real people who deserve to be allowed to stay alive (and much more than that by the way). You see all these referenences on the SUV liberal site dailykos to the number of soliders that have died but this is a very smaller number to the number of innocent non-white people murdered by the rich white male terrorists.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...


How much clearer can I be?

It is the Palestinians who are shelling Israel on a near-daily basis, which necessitates Israel's need to defend itself.

I know you are incapable of thoughts beyond ranting at "corporate terrorists" and "SUV Liberals," so I do not expect you to understand that. I realize your brain is incapable of higher thought.

The death of the people on the beach was a tragedy, but it was a tragedy brought on by the PALESTINIANS. They are the ones who refuse to stop shelling, and elected Hamas, an organization whose stated purpose is to drive Israel into the sea.

If the Palestinians want the violence to stop, they should rise up and revolutionize. Let's see them taking to the streets, demanding that Hamas stop its policies of hiding amongst civilians, shelling Israel, and now its stated goals of increased suicide bombings. Let's see Palestinians take responsibility for their own actions.

They were offered a state many times, and have refused many times. The Grand Mufti of Palestine aided Hitler during WWII, and Hamas has stated it desired the destruction of the State of Israel. I believe in taking people at their word, so I have to assume the reason for the refusal of their own state is linked to a belief that Israelis/Jews do not deserve their own state.

I have to give madmen like Mighty Thor props. At least he is honest in his hate. Citisucks, you are a hater/nonthinker extraordinaire, and yet you pretend otherwise.

At least be honest about your beliefs. Eros directly quoted from the Protocols of Zion at one point - at least he was HONEST about his beliefs.

All I ask is you quit lying, because nobody is buying it.

And for the record, I do believe the Palestinians should get their own state - as soon as they are willing to lay down their arms and recognize the State of Israel. Before then, giving them a state would be a huge disaster.

It is a tragedy when innocents are killed - Palestinian or Israeli. However, I lay the blame squarely where it belongs - on the Palestinians.

Once they care about the lives of their sons and daughters over the deaths of Israel's sons and daughters, they will get their own state.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

I realize your brain is incapable of higher thought.-Well at least we know you are capable of one thing- projection-lol (aka projecting your own inadequecies onto someone else).
The death of the people on the beach was a tragedy, but it was a tragedy brought on by the PALESTINIANS.
Here we ago again-blame the brown people-always blame the brown people. Very good-you can repeat after Israel, Bu$h, and the MSM-but after all we're the nonthinkers, not you right-lol?
All I ask is you quit lying
Are you delusional? What am I lying about? So you know deny that the Denver pigs shot an innocent man with a soda can or am I lying about my true feelings that hearing about dead people makes me sad?

However, I lay the blame squarely where it belongs - on the Palestinians. Quit lying...and quit kissing Bu$hes ass while your at it. Then again that's why it is called the Democult-because they cater to you telling you, you don't have to change your lifestyle or do anything but "vote" (which given the current voting technology really means a lot-lol). Meanwhile they stand for the same things as the rethugs, but you get to be mind&^%&^ into thinking that you are better than a rethug-it allows for the ultimate form of hypocracy you can believe in what will help society, but having an easy life that actually destory society, but yet the democult allows you to focus on the belief part and forget about your destructive lifestyle.

Your in the second stage of accepting the truth. Your life will make a lot more sense when you reach the third stage. Then you will stop your childish name calling and accept the truth.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...


You are lying when you say you are not anti-Jewish. You are a rabid anti-semite if I ever saw one.

You do not believe Israelis have a right to defend themselves. You do not believe they have a right to their own state. You believe Israel is behind 9/11. And I am sure you delight in the deaths of Palestinians, because it gives you reason to say how Israel is so evil.

You do all that and say "I am not antisemitic. I looooove the Jews! They are my best friends, they rock!"

Yeah, right.

No one is buying it. At least no one with half a brain.

And your "corporate terrorist" bullshit is boring, trite, unoriginal, and old. Please come up with better material.

Oh, before this blog, I was a regular leftist. Now, in part directly due to this blog and people like you, I have come to realize the true threat of Islamicism. I refuse to vote for ANYONE that does not see the threat Islamicism is to the future of America and the world.

So yes, thank you for opening my eyes, I really appreciate it! I now see "the truth!"

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Anonymous Mighty Thor said...

"Miss R"--Example Of Self-Programmed Jew Disinfo Artist
(Mighty Thor, 11 Jun 06)

Yes, to Jew-liars like "Miss R," truth is hate, especially for such as Jews who hate the truth.

Truth is antisemitic, isn't it "Miss R"? And only what "Miss R" and maybe some other Jews say is the real SUBJECTIVISTIC truth.

"Miss R," u need to figure out that all non-semites are necessarily ANTISEMITIC in this Darwinian existence, and that antisemitism is mere obedience to God--ESPECIALLY NOWADAYS. U Jews are a race of criminals, conspirators, collectivists, narcissists, and hysterics whose basic religion, Talmudism, is simply worship of a war-God whom ur rabbies tell u worships u scummy, insane Jews. For indeed, insanity, as in form of fanatic hystericism is the resort of most desperate combatants in their last ditches, eh?

A "thinker," "Miss R" is someone who knows one must be honest in order to perceive the information of an objective universe--which objective universe Jews thematically reject. "Miss R," u're just a lower-level Jew suckalong who believes in Jew religion of "persecution-complex" and hysteria by which u justify all ur murders and frauds (vicariously perhaps, as we see). After all, u Jews understand a basic reality of warfare by which u Jews induce a subjectivist hysteria upon ur own minds, no less than the stupidest gentiles whom u victimize first as by means of the mass-corporate "Jews-media."

Islamic heretics, harkening back to the Judaic one God-the-Father, rejecting the Christian trinity, are what surely saved the Jews fm the most complete victory of St. Constantine the Great who ridded the Roman empire of Judaic anti-Christ vermin and bankers--this is the real historical picture and truth.

Yes, we true antisemites hate u Jews, and we try to keep such hatred within reason, like good scientists would. Life and history prove Jews are devious disease-of-opportunity who weed out excess weaklings among white Christians and gentile humanity generally, as Jews practice their fraud mentality and culture known as "MAMMON," built on heresy and fraud.

Thus historically Jews made a comeback against Christianity with the rise of Islam which Jews greatly abetted, celebrated, subsidized, and served. Then there was the great schism btwn Latin and Greek Christianity, then the rise of Protestantism, Jews thriving in the Ottoman empire preparing the breakout French Revolution when Rothschild Fractional-reserve Jew banking finally triumphed. (See G. Edward Griffin's "Creature From Jekyll Island.")

And it's the free internet, "Miss R," not just qrswave, which has exposed Jew conspiracy, mass murder, and Talmudic fraud. Jew fortunes must wane cyclically (biologically and historically) as the Jew parasite and conspiracy begins to destroy the gentile host it feeds upon and victimizes, as now with so many of our troops dying for Israel, as presently in Iraq and Afganistan, having breathed in all that depleted-uranium dust.

CONCLUSION: So pls continue, dear "Miss R," the very epitome of the Jew-liar, "spinner," and disinfo mouthpiece, confirming our patriot's perception of an objective God-given reality for us in ur negative fashion, affected as it is. U're actually quite eloquent and useful in ur not-all-there manner. Honest elections and death to the Fed. Thor

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I wont inject myself in this debate except to say that there is no doubt in my mind that Israel was behind 9/11. Guess who got caught on Liberty Island jumping up and down celebrating the collapse of the towers as it was happening? Arabs? No, a bunch of Israelis. It turns out they were mossad. NYPD cops, true to their form, beat the shit out of a couple of them, I remember reading an article about how the mother of one was whining about how her poor son was mistreated. Oh boo hoo. NYPD must be antisemitic for beating up mossad agents caught celebrating 9/11. We'll never know why they were immediately deported to Israel with no investigation in their possible role in the attacks.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

See, Mighty Thor, I don't even mind you.

At least you are openly a nut job, and openly hate Jews. You don't pretend to be anything but what you are.

Your opinions are nonsensical, completely devoid of logic or facts, and hate-filled, but at least you don't hide who you are - you are a PROUD hater.

It is people like Citisucks who I hold in far lower esteem than you - people who say hateful things about Israel and then say "I loooove the Jews! Jews are terrific! Antizionism isn't Antisemitism!"

If you are a hater, at least own up to your hate. That is all I ask. Do not pretend to be only "antizionist," because anyone with at least a pea-sized brain can see how hypocritical you are.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Anonymous Mighty Thor said...

"Miss R" Obsessed With Hatred
(Mighty Thor, 11 Jun 06)

Well "Miss R," I at least attempt to found my assertions with citations, premises for my proffered conclusions.

But isn't it just the problem "Miss R": who's really the "nut-job," etc., and how do we figure it out?--is it possible? U Jews are, for example, the ones insisting insanely and hysterically upon the false, cheap, popular religion, constantly pushed by the Jews-media, ad nauseum, known as the holohoax--which everyone else (not Jew) knows is lies and slander against the German and Christian people. (See Zundelsite.org, Ihr.org, and Codoh.com.)

And such holohoax expose' is why u Jews so much hate the free internet, eh? For if holohoax is really true, there'd be proof, right? But u Jews insist insanely and hysterically, no proof is needed; we should simply believe it as religion handed down by God and Jews. Anyone who seeks proof of holohoax is guilty of crime and "antisemitism," which antisemitism is supposed somehow to be especially immoral and criminal. Who's insane, Jew?

Why is Ernst Zundel in jail? What happened to David Irving?--they told the truth about u scummy, lying Jews, eh?

Meantime, while we enforce this insane Jew holohoax religion, we want to get rid of the people's Christianity, like the Ten Commandments monument in Alabama state Supreme Court Bldg, eh?

Israeli Jews, for example, later assisted by American Jews after the fact, attempted to murder the American sailors of the USS Liberty back in 1967, proof being the episode (including Israeli mass-murder of Egyptian prisoners-of-war nearby) was entirely recorded and observed by National Security Agency (NSA), as reported by James Bamberg (I believe) in his latest book on NSA--and this is aside fm all the other evidence which is overwhelming. Just google up a few websites for the facts on USS Liberty.

Criminals and conspirators hate the truth--obviously--because by means of the truth, they're exposed. Criminals, like Jews, don't want people to know the truth and be able to speak freely about it, eh?--it's bad for Jew business, eh?

And that's why Jews hate the truth, call it "antisemitic," and try to monopolize by means of the mass "Jews-media" and with counterfeited funds fm the Fed bribe, blackmail, and deceive the gentile host population with lies and lying's foundation, subjectivism, AND ESPECIALLY "MORALITY" as of "good-evil." Truth conveyed over the free internet, which Jews don't sufficiently control yet, is why Jews hate the internet, eh?

Thus Jews, worshippers of Talmud and lies (such as their pretended "persecution," this allegedly due to gentile "jealousy," as of Jews' signature ugly hooked-noses), so brilliantly thrive as disease-of-opportunity upon a delusional host culture suffering Spenglerian "Decline of the West," specifically as we see, in form of Kantian neo-Pelagianism and English Utilitarianism, this preceding French Revolution and rise of Jew-Rothschild fractional-reserve banking, key instrument by which u Jews now rule, topmost Jew masterminds as of Council on Foreign Relations (CFR--see TheNewAmerican.com) directing, lower-level Jews like u executing like the communist commissars of the thirties. (For expo on Talmud, see Michael A. Hoffman II's "Judaism's Strange Gods.")

Why is it u, "Miss R," want people to "admit" to obedience to God, hence "hatred" of Jew murderers (hence antisemitism)?--does it make u feel "morally" superior in all ur insanity and hysterical obsession? Who's the real "nutjob"? We already know u Jews obligatorally hate gentiles, their objectivistic (such as it is) culture, and Christians as u hate the truth, telling ur Jew-lies.

CONCLUSION: So TELL US "MISS R"--is there an objective reality by which to prove which of us, Jews or Christians, is lying and/or insane? Honest elections and death to the Fed. Thor

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

Miss R you make me laugh (at you by the way, not with you). I'm the lier, yet you quote things that I never said. You wish the world was black and white so therefore I must be at one extreme of the spectrum or the other. You see gray and all you can do is resort to childish name calling and insulting my intelligence.

Given that we don't have true and accurate elections in this country I really don't give a *&^%*& who you vote for or that you even vote.

I look forward to you 10 page comment of bull*&^% and imaginary delusional quotations about what I believe-lol.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Anonymous kenj said...

Miss R, here's a bit from Kathleen Christinsin:

"The PLO did recognize Israel's right to exist in 1988 as a condition of its participation in peace negotiations, but any continuing Palestinian obligation to adhere to this recognition has been obviated by Israel's refusal to offer a reciprocal recognition of the Palestinians' existence. The grave injustice inflicted on the Palestinians in 1948 and in the decades since has never been redressed, and this must be the centerpiece of any negotiating process. For the very reason that there is no established Palestinian state, the core issue in any negotiation should be, not recognition of Israel's legitimacy, but recognition of the Palestinians' right to exist as an independent, viable, sovereign state."

I accept the right of Israel to exist, along with many others. Is there any chance in the forseeable future that Israel will declare exactly what territories it is prepared to regard as the Palestinian state? Or are they still eyeing off favourable water catchment areas and trying to set up Bantustan style enclaves? The Palestinians obviously have claim over some territory as undeniably their own. Until Israel lays its cards on the table, the Palestinians are well and truly an illegaly occupied country and under UN legislation are entitled to resist.

You can get around this very simply. State once and for all what territories Israel is prepared to regard as the definitive Palestinian state. You can't do so because Israel has yet to determine how much land it wants to steal. That's the root of the problem and you won't get any solution till you face up to it.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

P.S. I openly admit to the things/people I hate. It is even on my blog in plain site for anyone to see (http://progressivesagainstdemocrats.blogspot.com). I'll even repost the list for you here: Rethugs, Repugs, Democraps,davybaby and his SUV liberal friends, and, all the other smalled dicked loosers who drive SUV's/trucks. Plus remind me to ad in the corporate terrorists (aka rich white men) forgot that one.

At Sunday, June 11, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...


So you don't hate Israel? You do not believe zionism is racism?

That's news to me!

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger *blonde bond* said...

oh man! that's horrible! if you don't mind me saying, this world needs god's kingdom. this whole site is a bit to political for me. as a jehovah's witness i'm politically nuetral. hey...can i ask you why your other site thing is called j-dub? i hope you never stop thinking. people need to think so they don't become calloused.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Erosoplier said...

miss r,

I think you have me mixed up with someone else. Or maybe I have a poor memory. When have I quoted from the Protocols of Zion? I may occasionally detest the behaviour of Jews, buy what makes you say I am a hater of Jews? The main beliefs I have about 9/11 are that it was an inside job, and that the Muslims were the patsies. I have no doubt that Jewish interests were involved in 9/11 - witness Silverstein - but I'd hardly characterise my position as being that "Israel is behind 9/11."

Show some evidence, or take all that back please.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous the "new" miss r said...


sometimes it appears that miss r is either 1) very ignorant of the current realities, OR 2) an "dis-information agent". Because, after all she has seen/heard, it is VERY UNLIKELY that someone (even people with low IQs) can not see the obvious. 911 was an inside job, and there are major Israeli/MOSSAD/"Jew" (AshkeNAZI) involvement... not just a minor participant, but major ORGANIZER (for example the 5 dancing MOSSAD agents caught filming the destruction, and the "MOving" van laced with EXPLOSIVES... and let's not forget the 200+ "Israeli Art Students" (what a load of bull) who were detained -------- ALL of these suspects were quietly released by high authority, back to Yisreal).


is an excellent source, very METHODICAL with ACTUAL PHOTOgraphs, Videos, Sound clips, and forensic analysis. Even I, who is a scientist, is astound by they careful and objective analysis...


And by the way, Zionists like to call people names that have NO application --- like "anti-semetic" which is HYPOCRITICAL since it is THEY who are SYSTEMATICALLY killing Palestinians (who are Semetic). Semetic people are from the MIDDLE EAST, they are BROWN skin, and have ARAB PHENOTYPES. The so-called "jews" are WHITE, they are WHITE, how obvious can you get, they are WHITE....

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I suck. And then, I swallow. All I can get. How dare you challenge my comfy preconceptions about my favorite country, the one which, by chance, I hail from somewhat? We are the good guys, don't you see? Killing innocent Israelis in a cafe in Tel Aviv is monstrous. Killing innocent Palestinians on a beach in Gaza is self defense. Logical, isn't it? Unless you're a deluded raving anti-semitic whose only real concern about the rising gas prices is: "Who's to shoe the bill for the next round of gas chambers?". That's you, isn't it? All that talk about Palestinians being human too, having rights too - just an all too transparent cover for your hate against the chosen people! When I came here, I was your usual, latte-sipping leftist. But now, after having been confronted with the real world, I thought it best for my well being to simply get in line with the mainstream rightwing narrative, which solely lays blame on those pesky, omnipresent Islamofascists, like Osama Spin Laden and Abu Musab "Nine Lives" Al Zarqawi. It might take two to tango, but let me tell you: it only needs one to rave. Just ask Ann Coulter...

In short, I'm wasting other people's oxygen. Someone kill me!

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous miss royally retarded said...

The above comment was by me. Guess I was too stupid to get my name to show up the first time.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

I know there are people with low IQs here, so I want to say for the record, I never wrote any of the posts, unless it says "Miss R."

As far as Eros goes,

You are saying you believe Mossad was behind 9/11. That in and of itself is hatred personified. That in and of itself is nutjob-itude personified.

Then there was your post on April 25th, right at this board. I will link it to you so you have it.


Here are some of the "pearls" you said.

Anyhoo, the Jews in Germany at this time weren't an underclass - they were as a group significantly wealthier than the average German, and with the Balfour declaration (1917 - ie mid-war) - where Britain pledged support in principle for the founding of a state of Israel in Palestine, their loyalties, in Germany and world-wide, shifted decisively towards Britain. Germany, harshly treated by the Versailles treaty (1919) and taking stock after the war came to the conclusion that they'd been betrayed by the Jews. Thus began the rot, because the German Jews didn't leave for the new Israel after the war - it didn't exist - they stayed in Germany.

A book recommendation: 'A Century of War: Anglo-American Oil Politics and the New World Order' (1992, 2004) by William Engdahl.

Implying the Jews had it coming during the Holocaust.

Okay, you did not quote directly from the Protocols of Zion, but that is close enough.

You are a hater through and through. Why not at least admit it, like Thor does?

As far as others, I am not from Israel, and I have never even been there. However, I am planning a trip this summer to Israel in part due to the hatred seen on this board. I want to support a country I hold in such great esteem.


It is the Palestinians who insist on firing Kassam rockets into Israel. It is the Palestinians who insist on suicide bombing. And it is Palestinians who elected Hamas, an organization that refuses to recognize Israel, and in fact wants to drive Israel into the sea.

So therefore, your entire passage is irrelevant.

What I find astonishing here is the level of hate that qrswave hosts on her board. It is quite astonishing, the level of hate she generates and tolerates. Astonishing indeed.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

Oh, and Citisucks, by saying the following in a comment to THIS VERY POST, you show your hatred of Israel, and hence the Jewish people.

So now miss r. is defending the pigs.

That shows your hatred for Israel off the bat. What I find astonishing is how you all will say the most vile things imaginable about Israel, and then deny you said it! Or say afterwards "I only hate Israel, the one Jewish state in the world, and which has a better human rights record than most nations in the world. I don't hate the Jews, I LOVE the Jews, they ROCK!"

Anyone with above even the slightest grip on reality can see how nonsensical that is.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

Oh, and to the idiot posting at 5 am under the name "new miss r":

Jews have lived in Israel continuously since recorded history. In constrast, Islam as a religion is barely more than 1,000 years old. The tie that Jews have to the land is hence irrefutable.

I assume you have never been to Israel, but in fact many Israelis look exactly like Palestinians. Why is this? Because they are "sephardic Jews," and have ancestors who have been living in Israel since recorded history.

As far as "settlors," they purchased land lawfully from absentee owners.

So, your theory about Israel is pretty much lies/hatred taken as fact. Sorry to disappoint you.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Miss R said...

Please excuse my maniacal rantings on this blog. I am simply yet another brainwashed product of the Zionist state. I am struggling to extract my head from my bum in order to join the ranks of reality and critically thinking adults...it just takes time. Please forgive me.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Jews have lived in Israel continuously since recorded history. In constrast, Islam as a religion is barely more than 1,000 years old. The tie that Jews have to the land is hence irrefutable."

You are quite foolish and obviously have a very limited understanding of this issue. What on earth does the age of Islam and Judaism have to do with anything?

In biblical times, religious and ethnic mixing in Palestine was completely status quo and mundane.

As Hanna Braun states in A Basic History of Zionism:

"With the destruction of the Temple and the final fall of their autonomous Roman colony of Judea in 70 AD, the important families such as the High priests (Cohanim/Cohens), priests (Levyim/Levys), members of the Sanhedrin, the Judaic internal court that handed Jesus over to the Roman authority, and others, felt insecure. There had been a number of revolts and uprisings against their hegemony and their collaboration with Rome, Jesus being one non-violent example, and so they decided to leave when the Romans pulled out. Most of the indigenous subsistence farmers, craftsmen and small-time traders stayed put and continued their lives as before. Some of these inhabitants were early Christians and form the ancestors of many of today's Palestinian Christians, others remained vaguely Jewish. Modern research shows that when Islam arrived in the area in 638 AD many of these Jews converted and that their descendants form a considerable part of today's Palestinians. Numerous surnames, such as Moussa, Dini, Mansoor and Canaan inter alias are even nowadays shared by Arab Jews, Muslims and Christians. (Incidentally, people with the surnames Da Souza and Sassoon were originally from the Jewish community in Suza, the ancient capital of Persia). Those who left with the Romans later dispersed to other parts of Europe and even central Asia, where there were some trading outposts. A considerable part of European Jews, however, consisted of Khazars, inhabitants of an important kingdom in the early middle ages, roughly between the Caspian and the Black Seas. One of their Khans or kings converted to Judaism around 740 AD and made Judaism the state religion. In the 9th century Khazaria finally fell to the Viking hordes and its inhabitants dispersed throughout much of Europe. Thus the idea of a "return" of European Jews to their roots is something of an absurd myth."

"The various Jewish communities in Asia (including what is termed the Middle East) and North Africa were on the whole well integrated into their respective societies and apart from some isolated incidents did not experience the persecutions that later became so prevalent in Europe. In Palestine, for instance, Muslims repeatedly protected their Jewish neighbours from marauding crusaders; in one instance at least, Jews fought alongside Muslims to try and prevent crusaders from landing at Haifa's port, and Salah ad-Din Al-Ayoubi (Saladin), after re-conquering Jerusalem, invited the Jews back into the city.
The Jews in Moorish rule in the Iberian Peninsula flourished and experienced a renaissance mirroring that of the great Islamic civilisation and culture at the time. As Christianity spread from the north of Spain, Jews were again protected by Muslim rulers until the fall of Granada-the last Moorish kingdom to pass into Christian hands-when both Jews and Muslims were expelled at the end of the 15th century (Jews in 1492 and Muslims some 10 years later). Most of the Jews from the Iberian Peninsula settled in North Africa and the lands under Ottoman rule, including Palestine, and continued their peaceful co-existence with Muslims in those countries. It is interesting to note that some of these displaced Jews who had settled in Safad (Palestine) wrote laments about their expulsion from their “promised Land”, which for them had been Spain."

You can read more for yourself. In reality, Jews simply do not have any more "right to Palestine" than anyone else. Plain and simple. This notion of a "race" of persons coming along and staking claim to a land to which they assert some sort of ancient "right" is both absurd and nonsensical.

I suggest that Miss R take a look at by Mr. Arthur Koestler, an Ashkenazi Jew.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

Anytime that someone says they are "Miss R" but are not signed in as me, they are lying. I say this for the two brain celled people who often read/comment on this blog.

Anyway. Back to Anon 2:51 pm.

My point is that Jews have a long connection to the land, and hence are as "semetic" as anyone, having lived there continuously, since record history. Then, in the 1800s, more Jews moved to the land by lawfully purchasing land off absentee landlords. Those Jews were "Ashkenazi."

I fail to see how either Sephardic Jews, who have lived in Israel since recorded history, or Ashkenazi Jews, who lawfully purchased land from absentee landlords, are not wholly deserving of the land.

Your arguments are meritless.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Mighty Thor said...

No Evidence For "Jews" In Palestine Before 3rd Cent. BC
(Mighty Thor, 12 Jun 06)

"The Mythic Past" by Thomas Thompson demonstrates there's ABSOLUTELY NO ARCHAELOGIC or other evidence for any Jew (or Pharisaic, or predecessors thereto) presence in Palestine before 3rd cent. B.C. So far as we know "Jews" and their Pharisaic-Hasidic predecessors, connected with a banking cohort-component, migrated fm Babylon, perhaps fm time of Cyrus the Great Persian ruler, pretending their ancestors originally hailed fm these Palestinian hills.

"Miss R," u're really such a pathetic, ignorant, lower-level Jew psychopath and pathologic liar, typical of Jews. When u go to Israel, stay there and don't come back to this land, the USA, a nation made by and for white Christians. U scummy puke, "Miss R," who likes to call others "nutjobs"--don't forget this USA is for white Christians, not Jew hook-nosed shit like u. Honest elections and death to the Fed. Thor

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger qrswave said...

Since I am not well-versed in the ancient history of Palestine and its inhabitants, I will not comment. I assume, however, that original inhabitants generally have olive skin and hale from different faiths.

Again, I reiterate, my problem is not with the faith a person (or state) professes to adhere to, but with the substance of their policies and CONDUCT - which in Israel's case is as unconscionable as it is unacceptable.

Thor, please be civil. No need for name calling and other degrading comments. Stick to pertinent issues - not the shapes of people's noses.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Mighty Thor said...

U're right qrswave, we gotta keep our hatred under control of reason--that's the great human virtue.

Surely most of all, I think it's tremendous we get Jews like "Miss R" to broach their opinions and views in black and white, so emphatically and expressively, for the record on blogs like this--for it's trully quite revealing to get these creatures to speak fm the heart as they do, making the admissions they do for our information and knowledge, directly and indirectly.

Listening to (and reading) such as "Miss R" revealing her heartfelt disbelief and resentment that anyone could possibly be so antisemitic isn't just comical, it's important info for those of us blessed to be able to see it on such as this blog.

What is a subjectivistic mentality?--"Miss R" shows us definitively. Getting lost in such subjectivism is then definition of insanity--lost without that God-given handle provided by the God-given and -created objective reality, which doesn't essentially change, even for Jews.

Aren't u glad u're NOT a Jew, hubristic, collectivistic, narcissistic, hysterical, homicidal, addicted and habitual criminals, liars, and frauds? Honest elections and death to the Fed. Thor

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Jews have lived in Israel continuously since recorded history. In constrast, Islam as a religion is barely more than 1,000 years old. The tie that Jews have to the land is hence irrefutable."

I thought the Zionist shitty ghetto didn't exist until it was created on Palestenian land in 1948 creating millions of homeless palestenian refugees who live in squalor and exile to this day. I still have my grandfather's globe, it doesn't say "Israel" on it anywhere.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...


miss r.=stupid

And if your not stupid and you do know that, I am sure the MSM has a job for you where you can make lots of money pulling quotes out of context and creating lies.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

When I came here, I was your usual, latte-sipping leftist.

You better be getting those lefty latte's from blue democrap starbucks that cares so much about the world, it even hires child labors to burn their hands all day long so you can drive around in that SUV sipping your latte. Oh, and don't forget your credit card after all you wouldn't support the banking terrorists, except for some stupid reason you think you just have to have a credit card (even though they will create far more problems for you than cash).

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

Loving the snark. Thanks for the warning Miss R. about the fake Miss. R's. I would have never known they weren't you if you had not so kindly and gracefully informed me. So does this also mean that Bu$h didn't write the Zieg Heil to President Gasman speak in the some Holiday by Green Day?

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

spelling correction some should be song.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...


Evidence shows the shelling was not likely to be from Israel.

I doubt this will get any press coverage.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

Citisucks, so you are an anarchist now? Well, that's nothing new.

So felons should be able to do whatever they want, unfettered by police.

That's good to know. So I guess if a murderer comes to kill you, you would be fine if the police are not there to save you. You are anti-police, after all.

At Monday, June 12, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

Trust me, if someone comes to murder me the police won't be there, especially when the murderer is a rich white corporate terrorist stealing all my money and starving me. On the contray i could easily be shot by the police for no reason at all. The pigs exist to uphold the white male corporate terrorist order. I've needed the police 2x and they were worse than worthless both times. I'll handle my own problems.

At Tuesday, June 13, 2006, Blogger Red Tulips said...

That is one of the stupidest things I have read in a long while. So you are saying the police do NO GOOD AT ALL. Wow, just wow. *shakes head*

And I have read many stupid things.

At Tuesday, June 13, 2006, Anonymous Anonymous said...

fuck israel, fuck everything these greedy fucks stand for. i hope soon some fucks like north korea or pakistan nuke the shit out these soulless bastards and decapitate their stupid daughters into pieces.

USA...dump israel and fuckin nuke them, test your 200 megaton shit on telaviv, we'll all be watching.

At Tuesday, June 13, 2006, Blogger Citisucks said...

Miss R,
Put down the democult latte, stop reading, and join the real life club. Oh wait let me guess your a rich white girl-you don't have to join it.


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