Dear Israel,
Thanks!
We promise to pay you back.
We promise to pay you back.
Love,
Beirut
posted by qrswave @ Wednesday, July 19, 2006
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108 Comments:
Is that a threat?
Wow, you are looking more and more like a terrorist every day!
Excuse me?
That's a thank you note.
"We promise to pay you back."
Sounds rather like a threat to me.
Really?
You must have a sick and twisted mind.
I just want to say something else.
I refuse to be a dhimmi. I will not submit to Islamofacism. Neither will Israelis. And thank (non-existent god) that Israel is there to defend the freedom of the West that America is unwilling to do.
The world is a better place for it.
qrswave:
No, I am a follower of your blog. It is quite clear what "we promise to pay you back" was meant to imply. I see the way you think. You think just like an Islamofacist.
And I will never submit.
You need rest.
Then what the fuck is it when glazed eyed israeli kids write notes to the palestinian and lebanese children on the bombs that caused this destruction?
As much as I hate to say it, I wish israel could be "surgically" removed from the planet. They obviously lack the necessary humanity to run a legitimate state.
Anon:
http://www.sandmonkey.org/2006/07/18/the-fucked-up-pictures-explained/#comments
1) The kids said "To NASRALLAH with love." (not to the Lebanese with love)
2) The kids were egged on by the AP photographer
SPREAD THE WORD! THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE!
To disaffected youth:
Why don't you bang your skull repeatedly against the wall or something..
Wait.. isn't that what those loony jews do at the wailing wall anyway.
When the Jews captured the Wailing Wall, they were singing
Muhammad mat , khallaf banat
Muhammad died
Left behind him, or inherited by (females)
They are correct
When Beirut and the whole Arab/muslim world start to have balls and behave like men
Then Israel will fuck with the Arab world no more
Until then, the fucking shall continue ………..
If Israeli kids can write messages to Lebonese children on artillery shells then no Israeli should be saying anything about the above!!
Tracy
As much as I hate to say it, I wish israel could be "surgically" removed from the planet. They obviously lack the necessary humanity to run a legitimate state.
I honestly agree. I'm sick as shit of Israel and their pseudo-state. The majority of them are Europeans and have absolutely nothing to do with the Middle East. Yet their arrogance has allowed them to occupy, settle, torture, lie, and murder for years.
If Israel has the right to 'defend' itself, so does Lebanon, so, yes, I agree with the post...
The world would be much better off if all of those BA$TARD Zionists were dead or run into the sea.
I am an American who hates Nazi Israel and believes the death of Nazi Israel is best for world peace. They are all cowards who murder women and children. They are the cowards who attacked the USS Liberty in 1967, straffed the life boats and tried to blame it on Egypt, they are the cowards who attacked the World Trade Center on 9/11. They are the cowards who are commiting GENOCIDE on the peaceful Palestinian people.
Phuck every Zionist loving swein-hunt in the world!
NUKE NAZI ISRAEL WITH THEIR FAGGOTT BEANIES
Perhaps, the more approriate rebuttal would have been
"Dear Israel,
Thanks! We promise to return the gift.
Love, Lebanon"
Proving once again, that no good deed goes unpunished.
Of course it is a threat. What do you expect? Bomb a country to rubble and nobody is resenting that?
Got to laugh at jews staring at picture exposing their murderous hatred, then whining with self-righteous piety and all-too stale theatrics: "Is that a threat?". Yes, the Judeo-supremacists really do not let the rest of world forget what a beacon of morality it is, and how without it the rest of the world would not exist. Funny. History kinda says otherwise. But thanks for selling US secrets to China, and US military hardware to narco-terrorists, for blowing up the King David Hotel, for graciously offering the Lavon Affair, and the terrorist murder of Dr. Bull, thankyou Rosenbergs, thankyou Pollard and Franklin , the world thanks you for your tireless efforts to preserve the "West", lets all give three cheers for the beauty that is the jews-ONLY! "state" hip-hip BIGOTS! hip hip BIGOTS! hip hip BIGOTS! discussion over
"Vengeance is Mine!", says the Lord. He will do a much more thorough job than anyone else :O
I hope they do give them some payback.
Israel and Zionists are lying thieving scum and always have been. Masters of Deceit and of course its very easy to deceive ignorant Americans, who mostly are dumber than a box of rocks.
For any Israel supporters here, let me clue you in on something. You haven't seen nothing yet. There are many of us NON Muslims who are going to pay you back for what you did to Lebanon. GUARANTEED. and yes, thats a threat. And YES, it will involve TARISM because we can't afford hi tech weaponry but we have lots of other things in mind that is going to create havoc. Most of the world wants Israel wiped off the map. They are PIGS and pure arrogant scum, but always are whining how peaceful they are and how they all want to 'get along'. Bullshit, they are lying manipulative scum but their day is coming.
Hmm, some problems with the logic here. Hezbollah started this round of fighting, apparantly going over the head of the Lebanonese state and dragging it into war.
A war it would be complicit in if it was behind Hezbollah in this.
Essentially, if Beirut can do something to pay back the Israelis, why can't they stand up to Hezbollah?
And if they support the actions of Hezbollah, how can they cry foul over being at war?
All Hezbollah needs to do is release the soldiers it captured. Easy enough, no? As far as I'm concerned, they deserve it.
"1) The kids said "To NASRALLAH with love." (not to the Lebanese with love)
2) The kids were egged on by the AP photographer"
1) israeli kids just happened to be in an ammo dump during a war? [regardless of what they wrote..]
2) Like the dancing palestinians after 9/11? ... Oh wait, those were ISRAELIS......
The jews are the only race that love the smell of their own shit.
That's why I gave them such big noses.
-Yahweh
To disaffected youth: If you are defending the West; shouldn't you be in the West? What are you doing in the middle east; you ashkeNAZI sonofa.....?
The other day I got talking to a Sri Lankan( probably a Buddhist or a Hindu) and the subject somehow turned to the middle east. Guess what he says to me: " Why did Hitler leave half of them behind?"
I couldn't believe my ears. Here was a guy who had nothing to do with Muslims, expressing his opinion of the these criminal thieving Jewterriers. Hitler throws them in the microwave and suddenly we are told that they all belong to Jerusalem, because their grandmamas were all holy land grannies.
Damn these evil bloodthirsty bast*rds.
To lure Americans into their trap, they'll keep telling them that it's their battle they are fighting: NOT the fact that it is THEY who are drawing the U.S. into wars all over and who is paying the price: American kids. How many JEWS do you think there are in the Army? They're all busy on Wall Street, making money which they then use to fill congressional pockets.
Lord have mercy!
I am an American and I hate those Zionist pieces of trash in America and Israel. I am sick and tired of the racist and Jew superiority crap. Israel is a terrorist state and always has been since its inception. Israel should be surgically removed from the Middle East. Amen to that.
disaffected youth is a terrorist. He comes on truth telling blogs like this to terrorize the truth tellers and attempts to prevent the real story from being told. I wonder how much of that US taxpayer money he's getting for his efforts? Israel probably isn't paying for him to waste his time here, most likely syphoning directly from our government.
The jig is up pal, people are waking up every day to the shit people like you do to subvert our government. Go back to israel since it is such a fucking fantastic great place to be according to you. Dirtbag.
There is such a thin line between coherent outrage and silly racism, be careful of stereotypes and of oversimplification. Don't forget too that with the global economy, our litterature sometimes get translated and sold in far away places. So even the hindu might have come in contact with antisemitic tracts. Also, beware of the 'JEWS' thing you've got going on. Can you spot one in a crowd? I can't. You've got any tips? I remember seeing a pamphlet somewhere that illustrated the facial characteristics of the common jew...what? oh yeah, that was from nazi germany.
Seriously, there are some great books out there (serious, historical books) that explain the origins of antisemitism (the real thing, not criticism of israeli policy) and the origins of the whole stereotypes. You should check them out. If you care that is.
Look both sides in this dispute have their own share of blame, this said being critical of Israels over zelous repsonse is no way, shape, or form a voice of support of violence or terrorism.
Turn the other cheek, and treat your fellow MAN (muslim, jew, christian, green alien) as you want to be treated.
Disaffected youth is probably a jewish teen whose parents could afford a 2 million USD bar mitzvah (by selling defective body armour to the US military), while poor white,black,hispanic kids get blown away in Iraq.
Chosen people my ass!!!
Israel is a rabid dog. And what do you do with a rabid dog? That's right.... You put it down.
Israel is a sideshow. While Israel drops bombs, the US gov't curbs our rights by stealing private lands, caging peaceful demonstrators, pressuring Amazon to drop the book "America Deceived" by E.A. Blayre III and wire-tapping phones without 'probable cause'. Soon, the US will attack Iran throwing the entire region into chaos. Add in another false-flag attack on US (like 9/11) and the masses will beg for the safety of One World Gov't.
Support indy media.
Final link (before Google Books bends to pressure and drops the book):
http://www.iuniverse.com/bookstore/book_detail.asp?&isbn=0-595-38523-0
The zionazi shills only lie and practice transference. ( Ya know that O.T. tradition od scapegoating) as if that absolves the guilty of their sins. There is no greter sociopath than a zionist.
The earth has a cancer and it is called Israel. Yes Israel needs to be removed from the planet. We would all be so much better off without the monsters among us. Jesus called the early pharisees hypocrits and vipers. They still are. No one will cry tears when evil reaps all it has sown.
You shills are lowest life form. You cry that you are victim as you perpetrate. You lie to please the satan you bow to. And falsely claim you are chosen when you are the 13th tribe. You are the vilest hypocrits to slime across Gods good earth. Every moment of every day. I pray your evil is removed from this earth. As you are more toxic than the WMD you cherish. You are the hideuos destroyers. And I thank God that mercy is tempered with justice. You will get as you put out, eventually. It is the consequence you chose everyday. Your lies will not save you. Neither can you blind the seeing. TRUTH IS ETERNAL. It is lies that fall apart. And you will face your final judgement. It is prophecied you will be destroyed. Unwittingly you vile creatures destroy your own souls everyday. As you vioate all of Gods laws and Commandments you were given. You are the Synagogue of Satan refered to in Revelations. And the beast upon which the great whore the Neocons ride.
Lurk,
You mean those pamhplets in ashkeNAZI Germany? Right??? Think about that one.
Speaking about further racism, I have nothing against semetic people, that is people of semetic orgin, that is arabic/middle eastern descent.
I have a problem with white fake jews originating from Khazaria saying that Palestine is theirs. You know, those ashkeNAZI's.
IDF in another terrorist massacre
20.07.2006 Source: http://english.pravda.ru/opinion/columnists/20-07-2006/83399-idfterrorists-0
Lebanese civilians - children, women, elderly people who spent their lives looking after their loved ones. Israeli military equipment provided by the USA. Bombs drop. Screams. Terror. Limbs blasted off children, old ladies blinded. Another Israeli terrorist attack slaughters 55 civilians in Lebanon today.
The IDF today violated the Lebanese border, launching an invasion which resulted in heavy fighting with Hezbollah. Two Israeli troops and one Hezbollah guerrilla died but this was nothing compared with the heavy civilian casualties causesd by Israel's terrorist strikes from the air. Today 55 more innocent civilians were slaughtered by the Israeli Air Force, bringing the total of civilians murdered in terrorist strikes to around 300 in the last week.
Timothy BANCROFT-HINCHEY
Anonymous said...
Lurk,
You mean those pamhplets in ashkeNAZI Germany? Right??? Think about that one.
Speaking about further racism, I have nothing against semetic people, that is people of semetic orgin, that is arabic/middle eastern descent.
I have a problem with white fake jews originating from Khazaria saying that Palestine is theirs. You know, those ashkeNAZI's.
Wed Jul 19, 06:15:02 PM EDT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> THANK YOU >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
We can all help by spreading the TRUTH --- you know, Truth as in "SOMETHING THAT IS TRUE, AND IS BACKED UP BY ACTUAL FACTUAL EMPERICAL EVIDENCE". Not "truth" as in whatever the Ashkenazis tell you.
i have been reading these forums for a while. I read a lot of forums, with opposing views, sometimes completely irrational ones too, on both sides.
Its easy, I think in the heat, for terms to get blurred and a general descent into cyber-fighting takes a firm hold.
I am reading this hoping that when I see the word 'Jew' and a littany of anger ensures it means Zionism. Jews suffer under this system too. Those who suffered in WWII seem to be have been capitolised on by Zionism, which seems to have operated using Jewish suffering during WWII as a base to achieve a moral highground. On this 'moral highground' atrocities have been very simple to execute.
I'm wondering if that is true, that it be recognised, and angst directed to Zionism and not Judaism ?
http://www.adnki.com/index_2Level_English.php?cat=Security&loid=8.0.322578407&par
Dear previous anon, the "angst" is directed by the WHITE Ashkenazi "jews" towards CHRISTIANS in Lebanon. See recent news below: Another "gift" from Israel to our "pals" in Lebanon (no pun intended).
MIDDLE EAST: ISRAELIS TARGET CHRISTIAN PART OF BEIRUT
Beirut, 19 July (AKI) - Israeli warplanes targeted for the first time a Christian area of eastern Beirut on Wednesday morning. No one was reportedly injured in the attack. Two trucks were hit near the department store 'Abc' in the heart of the Ashrafiyah neighbourhood. The two vehicles were however not reportedly transporting missiles as initially thought. Residents panicked and took to the streets after the raid. "We aren't safe here anymore," Ratiba Naaman told Adnkronos International (AKI).
A 73-year-old Palestinian refugee who moved to Lebanon in 1948, Naaman wondered: "Why are they attacking these areas? It is them who are the terrorists."
Carole Haddad, who owns a pharmacy near the 'Abc' department store, said: "I hate Nasrallah (the leader of the Shiite guerrille Hesbollah, which is backed by Syria and Iran) and his warmongers, I hate Iran, but I am also Lebanese and cannot stand that my country is destroyed. The Israelis are terrorists like Ahmadinejad."
Most residents of Ashrafiyah were expected to leave their homes on Wednesday.
(Lto/Aki)
Jul-19-06 10:58
So why why aren't the moderate, peace loving jews(if such thing exist) do something about the Zionist. Silence means complicity.
http://mparent7777.livejournal.com/10368791.html
IT IS RAINING BLOOD IN LEBANON: The Zionists have been busy
IT IS RAINING BLOOD IN LEBANON
While I have been away the basteds(sic) have wasted the website running the following article.
From The Lebanese People To The So Called “Civilized” West
Note for Zionists:
We shall overcome shall overcome, mutherfuckers(sic).
HOW ISRAEL CONTROLS WHAT YOU READ | TPMCafe
Your editor also posts other articles at the site above, where a nest of sanayim(traitorous volunteers for the Mossad and other Zionists) peddle their death-making.
For example:
Israeli Attacks Kill Civilians: Photos
You will find a host of articles leading to photos archived at this current website indicative of what the Lebanese people are "thanking" the great white West for.
http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/14409
Note: If you cannot see the photos simply click the link below them, then click back.
http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20060715/i/r3453024992.jpg
http://mparent7777.livejournal.com/10348252.html
http://angryarab.blogspot.com/2006/07/i-have-just-received-these-pictures.html
http://jacksonisfurtherawaythancrazy.blogspot.com/
ISRAEL PLANNED CAPTURE OF PALESTINIAN GOVERNMENT LONG BEFORE ALLEGED KIDNAPPING
Bush has given these animals more time to slaughter the innocent. United States to Israel: you have one more week to blast you have one more week to blast Hizbullah Translation : The Fuehrer has given the Huns one more week to shred lives, maim babies, and to end what could be for countless.
A week is a LONG time . The Israelis have bombed Lebanon over a thousand times already!
19.07.06: Martin Rowson on the Middle East crisis
© Martin Rowson 2006
martin.rowson1@ntlworld.com
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/martinrowson/archive/0,,1284262,00.html
Progress in Lebanon
Die Welt, Germany - 13 hours ago
... Israel's Major-General Eisenkot said Tuesday that 'the IDF has hit over 1,000 targets,... [And they call it progress...]
3 Heavy Explosions Heard in Beirut
phillyBurbs.com, PA - 17 minutes ago
... Also Wednesday, Lebanon's prime minister said that 300 people have been killed, 1,000 have been wounded and a half-million displaced in Israel's week-old onslaught on Lebanon.
Juan Cole urges you to act with haste: Juan Cole: Call Congress!
The Lebanese People "Thank You".
Top Photo:
http://www.indymedia.org/images/2006/07/842692.jpg
Crossposted at http://www.myleftwing.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=10498
Crossposted at: http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/marc_parent/2006/jul/19/how_israel_controls_what_you_read_tpmcafe
MARC PARENT
CRIMES AND CORRUPTIONS OF THE NEW WORLD ORDER NEWS
http://mparent7777.livejournal.com/
http://www.myleftwing.com/userDiary.do?personId=3693 NEW
http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/14409
http://www.dailykos.com/user/ccnwon
http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0%2C2106%2C3736973a12%2C00.html 6000 Iraqi civilians killed in last two months - UN
19 July 2006
BAGHDAD: About 6000 Iraqi civilians were killed in the last two months alone as casualties continued an "upward trend", the United Nations said on Tuesday.
The estimate, compiled with data from Baghdad morgue and the Health Ministry, is the latest attempt to give some statistical expression to the daily bloodshed in Baghdad and elsewhere. It was part of a bi-monthly UN report on human rights in Iraq.
In a country with barely functioning public institutions, where relatives routinely remove the bodies of victims for burial with little legal formality, any estimates of mortality from the violence are highly approximate.
But a surge in sectarian killing in the past few months has been seen in rising trends in those statistics that exist.
Baghdad morgue officials have said they took in 1595 bodies in June, 1375 in May and 1155 in April. Of those, about 80 per cent were victims of violent deaths, they said.
In December, in the first and only official US estimate of the cost of the war in Iraqi lives, President George W Bush said some 30,000 Iraqis had been killed since the 2003 invasion.
A website that compiles media reports of casualties now estimates civilian deaths alone at around 40,000. By no means all deaths have been reported in the media.
The UN noted Iraqi health officials have said a recent media reckoning of 50,000 dead is probably an underestimate.
The UN report included all the morgue entries for May and June in its total of violent deaths along with 1294 deaths recorded in May by the Health Ministry and 1554 in June.
That gave a total cited in the report of 5818 deaths in the two months, the "overwhelming majority" of them in Baghdad.
Health Ministry figures incorporated in a monthly report issued by the Interior Ministry, however, show a lower level of civilian deaths. According to that report, 935 civilians were killed in violence in May and 889 in June.
The UN report cited a Health Ministry figure of 6826 civilians killed in the first six months of 2006 and a morgue total of 14,338 bodies taken in in Baghdad in the same period.
...................................... Thank you Zionist Regime, Thank you America, ohhhhh Thank you ..............................
Israel has ruined the reputation of decent Jewry, world wide.
The zionist state no longer has legitimacy.
No matter how much they lie, their deeds speak for themselves.
48 YEARS OF BRUTAL OCCUPATION IS ENOUGH. WE ARE ALL PALESTINIANS, NOW.
Disaffected youth. Where the fuck are you? Stop banging your head against the wall, you silly jew.
We are not finished yet.
"Every Jew, who spills the blood of the Goyim (any and all non-Jews), is doing the same as making a sacrifice to God." Bammidber raba c 21 & Jalkut 772
Minor Tractates. Soferim 15, Rule 10. This is the saying of Rabbi Simon ben Yohai: Tob shebe goyyim harog ("Even the best of the gentiles should all be killed").
The Israelis provoked this war bc GWB was told at the last Bilderberger meeting that the NeoCons are OUT, and nuking Iran was also OUT.
Perle and the rest came slinking back to DC with their tails between their knees.
So, Israel and it's moronic leadership led by the villinous Olmert decided to do the war crimes, solo, and hope to suck in the US.
It didn't work.
Nobody wanted any.
We are all Palestinians, now.
No more war for Israel.
Put AIPAC in JAIL FOREVER.
"""So why why aren't the moderate, peace loving jews(if such thing exist) do something about the Zionist. Silence means complicity."""
i've thought about that one....
55 million indigenous indians
100 million africans
millions of mauris
millions of abhogrigines
millions of muslims
millions of jews
millions from darfur
millions from sudan
millions from the middle-east
apartheid israel
apartheid south africa
borderline apartheid UK
borderline apartheid USA
thats just this millenia.... with many more before this one....
is there ever gonna be a day, when moderate people actually do a damn thing to change a damn thing ?
apathy is killing this planet but it always has and its always gonna be there ?
i am greatful... if so called terrorism dont get me, bombed aircraft, civilians etc dont get me either, i got peak oil and possibly nuclear winters to look forward to dealing with....
its gonna be tough... so we may as well have some intellectual masterbation....
Who Would Jesus Bomb?
http://blog.myspace.com/jesus_q
This whole Hezbollah & Israel war seems so juvenile it’s hard for me to even comprehend. How can either group justify hundreds of innocent people dead over 2 (or is it 3 now) captured soldiers? And by the way, these soldiers are still alive, at least for now.
On first take, it seems like Israel (with America on it’s side) is over reacting to the capture of 2 soldiers, but then with more information on the history of this conflict from a Palestine fact site: www.palestinefacts.org, I am led to view Israel as perhaps a nation pushed up against the wall and fighting back.
Well, lets just hope they don't end up like Cartman's Sea People.
Anonymous said...
"Every Jew, who spills the blood of the Goyim (any and all non-Jews), is doing the same as making a sacrifice to God." Bammidber raba c 21 & Jalkut 772
Minor Tractates. Soferim 15, Rule 10. This is the saying of Rabbi Simon ben Yohai: Tob shebe goyyim harog ("Even the best of the gentiles should all be killed").
Wed Jul 19, 06:36:38 PM EDT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HOLY SHIT! Do you have more quotes?! Or do you speek "Hebrew"? Since I'm inclined to learn just so I can educate myself enough to DEBUNK their "sacred" Talmud.
Actually, I've heard more, but I'd like to be able to translate for myself, and teach others this Ultimate Perversion ---- the cancer of all of humankind.
Why is disaffected youth always the first poster whenever I check out the stories here? Probably because he's looking for a fight...
Islamofacism? Is that something like ripping people's homes away from them, keeping them in impoverished ghettos, kidnapping their friends and family, shelling them indiscriminately, forcing them to be second-class citizens, and then turning around and calling them terrorists when they try to regain their independence and freedom?
Where, disaffected youth, is your sense of outrage when these things occur?
Zionists aren't Torah true Jews any more than the masonic freaks of the Nation of Islam are true muslims. The one argument that hypocrites like decerebrated youth refuse to address is the one right out of Deuteronomy: G-d gave the land of Canaan to Israel on condition of Israel following his commandments and laws. G-d also said they would be cursed if they failed to do so.
Decerebrated Youth never addresses this subject because he knows the truth: the residents of the state of Israel are largely communists, socialists, secular idolaters and former Nazi camp kameraden polizei. Just look at how the Labor Zionists had thousands of REAL Sephardic Jews irradiated as part of the MK-Ultra program (www.barrychamish.com).
No real Jews would do that to their own people.
yes, with interest :)
and if we cannot, our children will. An honourable person does not deafault on debts!
Rabbi Schmabai!
No arab ever called me goyim!
I hope I don't run into those kooky rabbi today or I will introduce my goyim fist to their ugly faces.
death to israel
I can never be moderate against wanton destruction and terrorising civilians to change political policy (classical definition of terrorism).
I am an extremist - a proud one - when it comes to racists and word-twisters and children-killers and lawless outlaws.
Terrorists can run, but they cannot hide. They will be smoked out of their holes and made to pay the price. I swear on it, and I will write it for my future generations.
If terrorism goes unpunished, it fosters more.
Today, either you are with the civilized world, or against it. Take your pick.
I have noticed that disaffected youth hasn't posted any further garbage for quite some time. Cowardice? I think so.
"""Today, either you are with the civilized world, or against it. Take your pick."""
but what about the terrorists IN the so-called civilised world ?
what gives the so-called civilised world the right to declare another 'world' not civilised enough ?
and how the hell do you claim civilisation in one breath, leaving murderous sanctions, bombing and state funded domestic and foreign terrorism as your legacy ?
and its only a small number of people that need to be stopped.
if there are say 20 terrorists in one area, clearly identifiable and not anonymous, and twenty thousand terrorists that are anonymous and not clearly identifiable, dont you tune your skills on the 20 you know ?
Funnliy enough, the thousands left will reduce to mere hundreds !
The rise and rise of Russia
By M K Bhadrakumar
Ever since the famous "fireplace discussion" at the Chateau de Ramouillet outside Paris in 1975, where the club currently called Group of Eight took form, the world has come to expect a certain predictability in the outcome of its annual summits.
The summits were largely of symbolic nature - formalizing the drafts painstakingly worked out by "sherpas" scaling summit slopes in the preceding weeks and months in full public gaze. No earth-shaking decisions were to be expected. Yet the world kept looking on in the belief that the G8 flashed the alignments in international politics.
This year's summit in St Petersburg was no exception. Three things became apparent. First, Russia has unmistakably re-emerged as one of the geopolitical poles in the world.
No matter the daunting problems besetting Russia - large-scale poverty, derelict infrastructure, neglected social sectors, regional imbalances, nascent political institutions - Moscow is determined to play a significant role in international affairs.
This was starkly evident in an article by Russian Deputy Prime Minister and Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov, titled "The triad of national values", featured in Izvestia on Friday, coinciding with the arrival of US President George W Bush in St Petersburg.
In hard-hitting language, Ivanov declared that the days were gone when Russia could be pushed around, and that the Kremlin was fed up with the West's double standards on democracy whereby "a hysterical atmosphere was being artificially created and a political environment that was favorable for launching a process of overthrowing legally constituted governments was being formed".
What was extraordinary was that Ivanov offered no explanations for what Russia was about - no apologies, no long-winded justifications. He came straight to the point: "The practice of interstate relations where Russia incurred substantial economic losses as quid pro quo for gaining the friendliness of the leaders of certain foreign countries is a thing of the past."
Ivanov continued, "Today we not only have the means to defend ourselves but also - and this is far more important - something to defend. To an increasing degree, we are beginning to understand that Russia can only be a sovereign democracy; otherwise, we will be left with neither democracy nor Russia."
It was significant that the Kremlin resorted to such blunt talk on the eve of the G8 summit. It was deliberate. In the preceding weeks already, a certain "hardening" of the Kremlin stance was perceptible. To be sure, the Kremlin carefully weighed the factors at work, while setting the tone for the G8 summit.
The US campaign over President Vladimir Putin's "authoritarianism" reached such a high pitch that the Kremlin had no choice but to call the bluff. In retrospect, Washington overreached when US diplomats participated in the theatrical show in Moscow, "Another Russia", parodying Putin's leadership.
Putin told the Canadian Television (CTV) network, "These issues [democracy] are being used as an instrument to intervene in our domestic and foreign policy in order to have an influence on it ... Only those who themselves have a spotless human-rights record have the right to point finger at others."
Putin told the US National Broadcasting Co (NBC) network that Washington manipulated the US media except that it was a "lot more sophisticated". If the US intention behind the calibrated propaganda barrage against Moscow was aimed at pressuring the latter into making concessions on other issues, especially economic matters (a familiar US ploy against Russia), this time it didn't work.
The Russian position, in fact, toughened on the Iran nuclear issue and on energy security. Putin also revived the sharp criticism of the invasion of Iraq.
Washington miscalculated by hosting Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili - expressing solidarity with Saakashvili at a time of rising tensions over South Ossetia and supporting Georgia's bid for membership in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO). It was crude meddling - awkwardly timed.
The result was the Russian position visibly hardened on the question of "frozen conflicts". Moscow suggested that Abkhazia, a breakaway region in Georgia, should be given the floor at the United Nations Security Council to present its case against Tbilisi. It warned Tbilisi against attempting to resolve the South Ossetian problem through force. Moldova's separatist region of Transdniester announced a referendum on September 17 to decide whether the pro-Moscow enclave should "freely unite" with Russia. Abkhazia began mulling over a similar referendum.
At the same time, Moscow correctly assessed its factors of advantage. The political crisis in Ukraine and conclusive collapse of the "orange alliance" constituted a serious setback to US strategies.
Other factors that worked in Moscow' favor were: the dramatic turnaround of the security situation in Chechnya after the killing of Shamil Besayev; the successful launch of Rosneft's initial public offering; and the overall boom in the Russian economy - as evident in the decision to clear all debts with the Paris Club by August 21 and full convertibility of ruble and the follow-up decision to trade energy and other strategic goods in rubles. Most important, Putin was riding a phenomenal wave of popular support over 70 % (as against Bush's 30% popularity rating).
Thus the first striking thing about the G8 summit was that the Kremlin put on display the unquestionable and rapid strengthening of Russia's independence and its return to the international scene and in the global economy. Those who were scornful about the weak sides, small sins and oddities of Putin's Russia were reduced to stunned silence.
The Economist weekly, a consistent critic of Putin's Russia, poignantly asked: "So, what can the West do? The short answer is, not a lot. In the 1990s, an economically enfeebled Russia needed help from abroad. Unless the oil price unexpectedly collapses, no such leverage will be available in the near future.
"Politically, too, pressure from outside is likely to rebound. With the Kremlin once again firmly in control, Russia will almost certainly change only from within - or not at all ... The best policy now is not containment but 'wary engagement'."
Indeed, Bush echoed the same thought, though in colloquial idiom, in the northern German town of Stralsund, en route to St Petersburg: "My own view of dealing with President Putin is that nobody likes to be lectured a lot, and if you want to be an effective person, what you don't do is to scold the person publicly all the time; that you remind him where he may have a difference of opinion, but you do so in a respectful way, so you can then sit down and have a constructive dialogue. And that's exactly how I'm going to continue my relations with President Putin."
Despite Washington's "wary engagement" of Russia within the G8, a contradiction exists culturally, politically and strategically, which will be difficult to overcome in the near future. Curiously, it was left to a Chinese scholar to dwell on this paradigm.
People's Daily front-paged on Monday an article by Ruan Zongze of the China Institute of International Studies exploring an answer to the question as to how China should "get along" with the G8.
Ruan concluded, "Judging from current conditions, it is in Chinese interests to keep a convenient distance from the G8. It is quite unlikely that China will join this group in the short term. China is a developing country for which G8 as a club of the rich hasn't apparently kept reserved a comfortable seat. Moreover, G8 has its own set of political and economic standards, which China finds unacceptable at least for the present stage.
"Russia, for example, does not mix well with the group. It joined the club in 1998 out of political needs, but was reduced to a second-class citizen, and has had little say on economic questions. So Russia is eager to establish itself as an equal member of the group by taking the role of a host." [1]
An unresolved riddle, therefore, remains as the residue of the St Petersburg summit. Russia on its part would appear to anticipate the problem and to signal that it got its priorities all right. No sooner had the G8 summit ended than Putin meaningfully invited the heads of state of the Commonwealth of Independent States [2] countries for an "informal summit" in Moscow this Friday and Saturday.
But in any discussions over Russia's partnership with the West, it may be improper to club all Western nations together in the same breath. Actually, this also happens to be the second conspicuous vector to emerge out of the St Petersburg summit. Its significance is no less important than Russia's resurgence on the world stage.
While the focus understandably is on the resurgence of Russia and on the cooling of relations between the United States on the one side and Russia on the other, the primary reason the US dealt from such a patently weak hand at St Petersburg was the disunity within the trans-Atlantic camp.
Europe does not lack ambition, but it is in disarray - unable even to give itself a constitution. Certainly, it lacks a common foreign policy. With the exception of Britain, Europe views with uneasiness the US attempts to establish dominance over the Middle East and Central Asia. And despite Washington's recent charm diplomacy in the European capitals, the European public regards US policies with distaste. And with Bush's attempt to revive the US-German axis, France is once again edging toward an independent opinion.
And finally, the US has failed to establish commonality of interests with its Western partners (including Japan) in the policy of "tough love" toward Putin's Russia. Many European countries feel troubled about the ever-expanding balloon of hot air that NATO has become.
Europe feels dismay over the destabilization of Ukraine thanks to Bush's "color revolution". An economy with the highest growth rate in the post-Soviet space just two years ago is today crawling on its knees.
On the vital question of energy security, Europe's interests cannot be harmonized with the US strategies toward Russia. Russia quietly made a point by timing two energy mega-deals with Japan and Germany just ahead of the G8 summit.
On July 12, Sakhalin Energy, which operates the Sakhalin-II energy project and is developing two vast fields in Russia's Far East with estimated recoverable reserves of 150 million tonnes of oil and 500 billion cubic meters of gas, signed a deal to supply half a million tonnes of liquefied natural gas annually to Japan for a 15-year period.
And last Thursday, Russia's Gazprom and Germany's E.ON AG signed a framework agreement to swap assets in production, trade and sale of natural gas and relating to power industry. Gazprom will acquire the German company's stakes in gas companies in Hungary as well as in regional electricity and gas companies in return for Russia providing access to E.ON AG to Russia's Yuzhno-Russkoye deposits in the Tyumen region, which holds more than a trillion cubic meters of natural gas and will be the source for the US$10.5 billion North European Gas Pipeline project.
Putin had every reason to express satisfaction over the G8's final document on energy security. He asserted, "Until recently, energy security was understood as meaning stable energy supplies. Now we have convinced our partners that energy security is a far broader notion, including production, transportation and sale on the markets."
The G8 statement shows that the US game plan aimed at establishing its trans-Atlantic leadership in the energy dialogue with Russia lies in tatters.
A third aspect of the St Petersburg summit regards its "take" on the international scene. From this angle, Iran and the Middle East by far stole the show. All other issues previously bandied about as solid pressure points on Russia at St Petersburg - democracy and "frozen conflicts" in the post-Soviet space; Russia's policy toward its smaller neighbors - receded into the background.
Interestingly, Russia was not the only power at the G8 that found it difficult to go along with Bush when he laid full blame for tensions in Lebanon at the feet of Hezbollah - and with Syria and Iran. Other leaders, while condemning the kidnapping of Israeli soldiers, also criticized the disproportionate Israeli response.
Putin indirectly drew attention to the US isolation when he said Russia's advantage was that it did not close its doors to any parties to the Middle East conflict. Putin asserted that Russia's "regular contacts" with Hamas and Hezbollah actually helped to work on the G8's Middle East resolution. If this in itself wasn't an extraordinary statement, Putin rubbed it in: "Iran, of course, is an influential country in the region and its interests must be respected so as to prompt it to use its influence to change the situation [in Lebanon] for the better."
Putin also said Israeli military operations were pursuing a larger agenda than obtaining the release of the kidnapped soldiers and that Israel's confidence in its "military capabilities" would prove to be misplaced. The most significant point made by Putin was that the deployment of any international force in Lebanon must be on the basis of a mandate from the UN Security Council and that Russia would participate in any such operations, but "we first need to get the agreement from all the sides involved in the conflict".
Again, the G8 helped clarify the alchemy within the so-called "Iran Six" [3]. The G8 statement on Iran endorsed the Iran Six decisions calling for a halt to Tehran's nuclear-enrichment activities in return for a package of incentives, but at the press conference that followed the summit, Putin cautioned, "It is too early to speak about sanctions against Iran. We have not reached that stage yet ... I would rather not speak about this [sanctions] because raising this issue may create unfavorable conditions for the talks."
All in all, the G8 revealed the erosion in the United States' ability to bend the world to its will. The US exposed itself as having very little leverage in the Middle East situation. It seemed a shadow of what it used to be in that highly strategic region. It failed to get the G8 to fall in line on energy security or the Iran nuclear issue.
In the final analysis, what insight does the St Petersburg summit provide into the world of tomorrow? What comes to mind is an incident narrated by former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev during an interview last Friday regarding the summit. He said former US president Bill Clinton asked him when he first visited Moscow what advice he could give.
Gorbachev replied that he would give one important bit of advice, namely, to treat Russia with respect because Russians did not like being patted on the back. Gorbachev said he told Clinton, "Today we have one kind of situation and tomorrow it may be something different. But we will certainly rise, as we have done so many times before. We keep all that in our Russian memory."
Notes
1. The G8 comprises the members of the Group of Seven and Russia. The G7 members are Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom and the United States, which together account for about two-thirds of the world's economic output. Russia officially became the eighth member of the grouping at the 1997 Denver, Colorado, "Summit of the Eight". But while Russia is a G8 member, it does not participate in financial and economic discussions, which continue to be conducted by the G7. Russia has the G8's smallest economy.
2. The Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS) was created in December 1991. In the adopted declaration the participants of the commonwealth declared their interaction on the basis of sovereign equality. At present, the CIS unites Azerbaijan, Armenia, Belarus, Georgia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Moldova, Russia, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and Ukraine.
3. The "Iran Six" comprises the five permanent members of the UN Security Council - the United States, Russia, China, the UK and France - and Germany.
M K Bhadrakumar served as a career diplomat in the Indian Foreign Service for more than 29 years, with postings including ambassador to Uzbekistan (1995-98) and to Turkey (1998-2001).
The people in the Middle East have been Fighting since the beginning of TIME, and will be Fighting till the end of TIME, and George Bush has been suckered and brought America into it
Breaking news.
Disaffected youth is currently giving away free blowjobs to IDF troops, and it's all kosher.
NAZI = askeNAZI
Spread the word!
its a good thing that there are regional powers rising to the magnitude of super-power status to challenge the current hegemony.
i think it bodes well for the middle-east conflict. It bodes well for smaaller less potent nations.
the prize is if it can reduce the impact of Zionism. It only needs to deplete the economic slavery the world is under and the bombs that the palestinians are under.
To me - that is Zionism.
disaffected youth said... "And thank (non-existent god) that Israel is there to defend the freedom of the West that America is unwilling to do. The world is a better place for it."
Israel is not defending the freedom of the West. All the democracies of the West are having their democracies compromised and turned into police states because they are defending the indefensible by any other means than trickery, threachery and lies zionism.
You speak of Islamofacism. Don't you think radical Islamiscim might be a reaction to zionism? Apartheid by any flavor is injustice in principal whether it's white apartheid in Africa or Jewish apartheid in the Middle East. Israel is a racist supremacist genociding state, the source the terror in the Middle East.
Outlaw the racist idealogy of Zionism in Israel, then peace is possible. But then you'd lose that Jewish exclusivist, wouldn't you? You can't have peace without justice. Zionism in principle is unjust.
You can't understand the frustration of the original post? The rest of the world that is not indoctrinated as you are are getting fed up with having their humanity insulted and debased by the inhumanity that Israel is imposing on the world..... and playing the Jew card is wearing thin.... more and more Jew is being identified with inhumanity and brutality and stiffling any complaints about it.
Well said justa_wisegoy!
There are so many ignorant people on the web who throw around the term "Islamofascism" without even knowing what they're talking about.
Do these people even know what "fascism" means? It would mean that Muslims have been fusing state powers & corporate powers, but where or how has that been happening?
The United States & Israel are both much better examples of fascist states, if these ignorant "Islamofascist"-spouting fools would ever look into what they're talking about. Hezbollah has a few weak rockets, while Israel has billions of U.S. dollars (Americans' tax-dollars, mind you) to use jets, attack helicopters, ammunition, artillery, missiles, bombs, tanks, etc, all of which benefit the U.S. corporate arms manufacturers. Now THAT'S fascism, and THAT'S U.S./Israel.
All these "Islamofascist"-Fox News parrots just want an excuse to be racist against darker colored people whose history they don't know or care about.
Quick note about Israel's "democracy." What kind of democracy treats one religious group (Jews) above all others? Has a ritual of holding burials for children who marry outside of their religion (Judaism), as if anything but THEIR religion is a shame and a travesty worthy of cutting off ties with one's one kin? That's Israel for you. Non-Jews in Israel have many more rights & priveleges than non-Jews. How often does the mainstream media remind you of this? Never.
Palestine, on the other hand, held a democratic election in which they chose Hamas, and Israel decided THEY could tamper with the will of the Palestinians! Israel basically said, "Democratically-held election? Doesn't matter; we don't like your choice, so change it!" So we see how much "democracy" *really* matters to Israel: not much.
What goes around comes around. Israel can't destroy the entire Middle East and they can last in a war of attrition forever. The writing is on the wall Israel is doomed.
Ry www.anti-neocons.com
The End said...
There are so many ignorant people on the web who throw around the term "Islamofascism" without even knowing what they're talking about.
Do these people even know what "fascism" means? It would mean that Muslims have been fusing state powers & corporate powers, but where or how has that been happening?
The United States & Israel are both much better examples of fascist states, if these ignorant "Islamofascist"-spouting fools would ever look into what they're talking about. Hezbollah has a few weak rockets, while Israel has billions of U.S. dollars (Americans' tax-dollars, mind you) to use jets, attack helicopters, ammunition, artillery, missiles, bombs, tanks, etc, all of which benefit the U.S. corporate arms manufacturers. Now THAT'S fascism, and THAT'S U.S./Israel.
All these "Islamofascist"-Fox News parrots just want an excuse to be racist against darker colored people whose history they don't know or care about.
Wed Jul 19, 07:27:36 PM EDT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That you for the clarificatin the_end. We need to be as accurate as possible to be taken "seriously". I've noticed on several reputable websites, "certain" bloggers (I'll leave who these "certain" bloggers are, as an mental exercise to the readers) who DEFAME and DIS-CREDIT these websites by posing as supposed "911-truth seekers" and posting ridiculous postings concerning "UFOs".
This is an intentional attempt to DISCREDIT the actual 911-truthseekers. Likewise, we should IMMEDIATELY EXPOSE and correct (in the case of HONEST MISTAKES as above) any such attempts.
This is important to maintain the high level of integrity and knowledge that our members possess. The person who mentioned "islamofascim" I believe was making a point that the Recent Fundamental Islam movement is largely a result of the reaction to Fundamental Zionism/Talmudism.
That was the 'intent' I believe ---- but it was USEFUL to make the distinction that:
------------ "fascism" is the 'illegitimate' fusing state powers & corporate powers -------------
Since I always had the impression that it was "a government that uses its powers without heed to the will of its people". Facism was always used as a descriptive word, but never explained in school or TV. In this way fascism is very similar to Plutocracy, a state of 'government' which is ruled by the corrupt wealthy and powerful.
disaffected youth said...
"And thank (non-existent god) that Israel is there to defend the freedom of the West that America is unwilling to do"
This is a good example of the sickness of the state of Israel.
Far the most of the israeli's are not religious, but the existance of Israel is based on religious books! Torah or bible has little to do with science or history and far more with fairytales. And when religion would be applied, than you should all leave Palestine and wait for you prophet to return to earth to show you the way to the 'holy land' like Judaism tells.
BTW, I would love to see explode all zionist places outside Israel (for as now without casualties). Maybe than they'll learn a lesson.
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To Beirut:
your palestinian "brothers" who "care" for you so much did this a while back to us:
http://www.viaccess.net/local/messages/56/3956.jpg
we don't want that to happen, ON BOTH SIDES...
hope to see you soon at the peace summit, just don't bring hizballah and all will be ok, just this one time.
Take care,
Israel.
It is about time we destroy Israel before it destroys us.
the world looks on.
i'm a european and i feel as thou israel has attacked a part of europe.
if only the our leadership was more intune with the people. europe should get its revenge on israel for this.
to paraphrase a french news paper - after 9/11.
we're all lebanese now.
Anonymous said...
To Beirut:
"your palestinian "brothers" who "care" for you so much did this a while back to us"
Yep one of them did and maybe with some help from you guys. And as it's only a needle's prick compared to what you people do to the Palestinians it is almost irrelevant. It's what you do when you don't get F-16a F-16C F-16I F-15a F-15c F-15E and F-15I as a present.
Oops, I forgot the Apache and Cobra helicopters and probably the sniper-rifles israel used as recently as yesterday to kill some Palestinian boys.
What would a possible solution to this situation be? A society in which all the peoples can live side by side peacefully.
For this to be acheived the Zionest movement and any sign of it must be exterminated. They are the Nazis of today. This regime that governs Israel is a billion times more of a threat to world peace and stability than Saddam's ever was.
Also, the country has to be renamed. Israel sounds too much like Nazi.
Anonymous said...
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mmm, not sure I agree with you
Israel has sown the wind. Now let her reap the whirlwind.
Anonymous said...
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They are the modern day version.
Anonymous said...
It is about time we destroy Israel before it destroys us
Well, just position yourself at the end of a runway at NY JFK or Amsterdam Schiphol and fire a rocket propelled grenade or a SA-7 at a EL-AL 747 freighter and you will only kill 3 aircrew (and maybe a non-registrated shin-beth (wo)man), but you will receive extraordinary attention, and zionists will be shocked, will be really shocked. (make sure its not a flight with sarin chemicals or plutonium aboard, cause it really affects the local people)
In reading the majority of the replies here, I have come to the conclusion that certin bloggers here suffer from
"rectal Cranial Inversion"
Another words "They have Their heads up their arse".
The Bush admistration is evil and so is the Israeli zionist regime.
borkafatty said...
"... certin bloggers here suffer from"
"rectal Cranial Inversion"
"Another words "They have Their heads up their arse"
Im not a blogger, but as you probably have some experience with it, does it feel nice? I might try it also. (shame is for others)
Dov Goldsilverpearls said...
borkafatty said...
"... certin bloggers here suffer from"
"rectal Cranial Inversion"
"Another words "They have Their heads up their arse"
Im not a blogger, but as you probably have some experience with it, does it feel nice? I might try it also. (shame is for zionists)
"They (the Jews) work more effectively against us, than the enemy's armies. They are a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties and the great cause we
are engaged in ... It is much to be lamented that each state, long ago, has not hunted them down as pests to society and the greatest enemies we have to the
happiness of America." -- George Washington, America's first President, Maxims of George Washington by A. A. Appleton & Co.
Disaffected youth may not want to be Dhimmi,but seems happy to be a worshipful, Noahide GoyBoy wallowing in a cesspool of Jewish activism designed to debase and degenerate western society so that the Jew appears relatively a "light unto the world" in the Tikkun Olam tradition. The Jew gives the illusion that his light is brighter by darkening or extinguishing that of others.
Lebanon is a present experiencing repair consistent with Tikkun Olamist urgings of the Jew in all its self righteous majesty.
disaffected youth said...
I just want to say something else.
I refuse to be a dhimmi. I will not submit to Islamofacism. Neither will Israelis. And thank (non-existent god) that Israel is there to defend the freedom of the West that America is unwilling to do.
The world is a better place for it.
You want to know how to spot a jew plant in here.
They pretend to care about the people of America and call for action against Muslims to make America safer. They laugh at American christians who rally to protect israel because Chritians believe Jesus will return and setup God's kingdom in Israel. The US media might as well be called JEWNEWS. The last few day's they've make it too obvious ,and the doubt some had on jewish mafia's having full control of America's information systems is probably gone. Non-jews die-good, Jews die-bad.Do you see now? If Israel is the good guy's in this one.... man, even a redneck ain't that stupid!
Jews don't care if American's die. They don't care if Canadians die or Iragi's or anyone that isn't jewish. Don't be fooled by their swank , childish name calling and imaginative efforts to instill fear and boost feelings of Israel being the constant victum and America's sorrows and Israel's are one and the same.
"We feel your pain. NOW get out their and kill our enemies!"
They control America's politicians by blackmail and dance when American's die, as they did on 911. Don't believe them when they say it was just a couple of juvenile delinquents who were only movers and part time art students. These people want to sacrifice you for their own cause by any means, because to them , if you are not a jew, you are a tool. To be used and thrown away when the job is done, they wouldn't hesitate to kill a christian and blame the Mulsims, if it meant they would get an edge. And they mean business. They see American's as stupid-anti-social creatures for slaughtering their enemies and jews will go on deceiving the ignorant until Jesus returns and casts those son's of satan , those great deceivers into the lake of fire.
It amazes me how our leaders forget so quickly about the autrocities of Israel. I'm listening to the radio right now, and the commentator is blaiming the Palestinians for everthing. Let me get this straight, wasn't it Israel that started the blood shed in the middle east. I suppose the Israeli's threw apples at the Palestinians that were sunning themselves on that beach.
Anon@5:35 EDT
I used to collect interesting rocks when I was a child and I kept them in a box. They would be very unhappy to be considered on an intellectual par with the Seppos. I hope they aren't reading this blog.
Perhaps if the United States hadn't placed them in the "holy" land (which by the way even if you believe the Bible, in the Old Testament God gave that land to the father of the arabic people according to the fable of Essau and Jacob) none of this shit would be taking place to begin with. Fundamentalist Islamic, Christians, and Jews all need to just drink the fucking kool-aid and get it over with. I have no problem with a bunch of religious nut jobs offing one another, just leave the peaceful civilians and control of their governments out of it.
Don't give me the anti-semitic rhetoric either Buttercup, as the vast majority of those currently occupying Israel aren't semitic in origin, but rather were Russian khazars given the land they now call Israel. The U.N. attempts to sanction them, and the US vetos the resolutions everytime as a permanent member of the Security Council. AIPAC buys our representatives and then spies on America, and teaches her to be as vicious as Israelis have become. Fuck Israel and the corrupt politicians bought by them running our country.
So you can take that shallow Israel right or wrong loving world view of yours, and cram it straight up your ass. True patriots in America are becoming aware at an increasing rate and once we abolish the fascists you have assisted to instill in our system of governance, we won't be forgetting who paid for them. You had better learn to deal with reality, or reality will find a way to deal with you.
"So you can take that shallow Israel right or wrong loving world view of yours, and cram it straight up your ass. True patriots in America are becoming aware at an increasing rate and once we abolish the fascists you have assisted to instill in our system of governance, we won't be forgetting who paid for them. You had better learn to deal with reality, or reality will find a way to deal with you."
Halle-freakin-lujah brother! Time to stock up on ammo!
RisingLegion said...
quote:
"Perhaps if the United States hadn't placed them in the "holy" land (which by the way even if you believe the Bible, in the Old Testament God gave that land to the father of the arabic people according to the fable of Essau and Jacob) none of this shit would be taking place to begin with. Fundamentalist Islamic, Christians, and Jews all need to just drink the fucking kool-aid and get it over with. I have no problem with a bunch of religious nut jobs offing one another, just leave the peaceful civilians and control of their governments out of it. "
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's just aint gonna happen --- they'll nuke us first, the 3rd world countries are going to get "cleansed" and even us in 2nd or 1st world countries are going to be bombed as well. It PISSES me off royally how the Zionists don't give a shit about anyone else but themselves. If we could give
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey, by the way the AIPAC SPY SCANDAL TRIAL has been "post-poned".
quote:
"So you can take that shallow Israel right or wrong loving world view of yours, and cram it straight up your ass. True patriots in America are becoming aware at an increasing rate and once we abolish the fascists you have assisted to instill in our system of governance, we won't be forgetting who paid for them. You had better learn to deal with reality, or reality will find a way to deal with you.""
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Remember one thing folks --- KARMA --- that is "What goes around, comes around"
Wow, sure looks like all the hate-mongers have got you people to swallow a lot of it. Let's just keep this up and teach it to our kids, and with a little luck, humanity will never evolve beyond this BS that keeps us down. There are insane people everywhere who end up getting into power situations because they are the most aggressive/destructive. They want to spread their anger because it supports their cause. This is feeding it. Think you're angry, think about how angry the Palestinians/Jews are. So angry in fact that nothing is going to stop them from trying to destroy the other. See a pattern here? How do we get out of it? Certainly the path we're on has shown a few times to not really have the greatest results. You think at some point you'll convince anyone that one side is good and the other side is bad. People need to calm down. Of course there are those on both side who think the world would be better off without the other, but this is not the majority, and this is not going to happen. And until there's a critical mass of people willing to not buy into the bullshit from the leaders and their media mouthpieces, this is what we get. And the kind of malicious vitriol that is getting thrown around here and in the blogosphere ad infinitum is only fanning the flames.
COME ON PEOPLE!
Yes, things are bad and pretty hopeless seeming, but what about a little compassion and seeing through the fact that the majority of people do not tow the party line of the insane power structure.
"I will leave you there and melt you" (Ezekiel)
Israel=Desert Glass
Heaven's Gate Opens :O
Mike-
As I was reading this collection of comments, the angrier I became. Then I read your post- probably the most sensible entry on here. You are right- hate begets more hate. Like another poster said, I wouldn't mind if all the power mad wackos killed each other off- it's the civilians that suffer that pisses me off.
See video that reveals facts about Israel and Lebanon that the MSM isn't telling you. "see video about Israel and Lebanon
"Wow, sure looks like all the hate-mongers have got you people to swallow a lot of it. Let's just keep this up and teach it to our kids, and with a little luck, humanity will never evolve beyond this BS that keeps us down. There are insane people everywhere who end up getting into power situations because they are the most aggressive/destructive. They want to spread their anger because it supports their cause. This is feeding it. Think you're angry, think about how angry the Palestinians/Jews are. So angry in fact that nothing is going to stop them from trying to destroy the other. See a pattern here? How do we get out of it? Certainly the path we're on has shown a few times to not really have the greatest results. You think at some point you'll convince anyone that one side is good and the other side is bad. People need to calm down. Of course there are those on both side who think the world would be better off without the other, but this is not the majority, and this is not going to happen. And until there's a critical mass of people willing to not buy into the bullshit from the leaders and their media mouthpieces, this is what we get. And the kind of malicious vitriol that is getting thrown around here and in the blogosphere ad infinitum is only fanning the flames.
COME ON PEOPLE!
Yes, things are bad and pretty hopeless seeming, but what about a little compassion and seeing through the fact that the majority of people do not tow the party line of the insane power structure."
Mike,
I respect that perspective, and it is admirable that it is alive and well. You obviously are intelligent and articulate. The larger point here is probably made by a simplistic analogy:
We are all students out on the shool yard. Most of us students believe as you do. Then you have a small grouping of students that are intent upon in fighting amongst themselves. You don't agree with their in fighting, but you understand it. One of the groups is smaller than some they fight, but they fight on due to constantly inflicted torment by the other. The other group is made up mostly of two kids: one that has been picked on to the point of becoming the very bully they used to fear, and his big brother who whenever his younger bully of a brother gets in over his head backs him up. Whenever most of the kids can stay out of harms way and try to reason the aggressive groups to play nicely on the school yard, then there is hope. As the school year progresses though, and it becomes clearer to the peaceful children on the school yard that not only can they not reason with the opposing groups of children, but they themselves are made to suffer and may very well be the next target of either of the aggressing groups of kids, a choice must be made. Bullies only understand a bigger bully, or an overwhelming group of smaller children acting in unison. It just must be made clear that whenever the peace loving children are made to suffer, that it will be paid back to the aggressor ten fold. That the bully will suffer many times over of that pain which they have the capacity to inflict.
We all want peace, harmony and balance Mike. We all want to leave a better world to our children than that which was given to us. I am not choosing sides, other than my own. So long as the kids keep their misbehavior to themselves, then we have no issue. But you know bullies, they just won't stop until they have been introduced to the concrete. I don't care which group of bullies we are discussing. I'll be more than happy to help him up afterward, explain that I am sorry it had to happen, and that if it must happen again it will be far worse.
Don't tread on me...
People over here are becoming more & more aware that the state of Israel is Not our friend. More & more people are starting to cringe when one of our politicians says something like "today we are all Israelis". More & more people will take this slavish pandering to to Israel into account at the polls. Very soon supporting or being supported by Israel or one of it's many, many lobby groups will be the kiss of death for a politician. When that happens, the whole world will come crashing down around them, & it will be about Yaweh-damned time.
It used to be that being called an anti-semite meant that a person had an unreasonable prejudice agains people who practice Judaism. Now, however, the term is thrown around to describe
any criticism of Israel for any reason. Facts don't matter, nothing is open to fair & honest debate. We're expected to support them ineverything that they decide, no matter how much it contradicts our laws, morals, & conscience. No matter how many of are fellow human beings are killed, no matter how many of our kids are sent to die for wars that we should have no interest in.
Peaople are getting sick of of being called anti-semite for simply disagreeing with Israel's murderous policies. Anything said or done that does not meet the expectations of Israel is Anti-semetic.....& that is a shame because the term means nothing now. The term that was once used to identify people who were a genuine threat to our friends & neighbors, is now a political tool.
What's even worse than this is something I haven't seen people mention yet. The word could soon lose a whole lot more effect, & in fact become more negative than imagined. What if people get sick enough of the term that people start to say:
"Well, if being opposed to supporting a nation that practices extra-judicial assasinations, bombings of civilian infrastructure, agressive wars, apartheid, racism, etc, etc, etc, etc makes me an anti-semite, then perhaps being called an anti-semite isn't so bad....maybe it now means Decent Human Being.
Just like the N-Word being adopted by the blacks to make it their own & take the sting out of a historically abusive term, maybe decent, thinking Gentiles whose only crime is opposing a state's policies will come to at least ignore the abuse of the word.
Imagine a world where Israeli apologist can no longer silence a person & instantly stifle debate with the term Anti-semite. That would be a world where people could feel comfortable saying enough. It would be a world with a far better chance of peace, in fact, it would be a better world period.
What I don't understand is: Hitler messes up with these guys for some reason and then suddenly they realize that all their grannies came from the holy land. I mean, you have to be really blind. How middle eastern looking was Yitzhak Rabin or any of these millions of European converts to Judaism? Yet they are not happy with the land they got. Oh no! They want more and more and more!!! Grab, rob, pillage, kill all day and in the evening visit the holocaust museum!
Cuss the Muslims all day and the moment you use the word JEW, you are told that's anti-semitic.
How long do they expect this ZIONAZI drama to play out?
Woe unto the Earth for Satan has been cast down among you knowing he has but a short time.
risinglegion,
While I agree in kind with your schoolyard analogy to some degree, I still don't think that the correct way to handle a bully is to continually lay them to the concrete, the next time more severe to the last. Before you know it, the lines between bully and bullied are blurred, as you said. Nonviolent protest and non-cooperation with bullies are really the only lasting solutions that will leave no reason for retaliation and will deflate the hate bubble. As long as one side thinks it can "whip the other side into submission" based on some superior moral stance, there will be no peace. Peace cannot be enforced, as it is always biased towards the enforcer and there will be no peace with resentment.
Idealist, probably, but it's not like the force option has had much lasting success, ever.
Mike,
You and I see things more closely than you might believe. I am not saying I as an individual would be that bigger bully in the analogy I gave, I was referring to the collective children in unison acting as an overwhelming force, and then attempting reason with those that previously refused reason. However, the analogy was obviously far too simplistic to adequately depict the events in the middle east, and Israel's influence on our representatives and the inevitable biased foreign policies it creates. There was an e-mail circulating around some time ago (Probably originating from some hate groups such as Freepers or Neo-nazis, whom I loathe more than most.) that has some underlying validity to it. It went something like this:
When you meet a peacenik...
1.) Approach ignorant moron talking about "peace" and saying that there should be "no retaliation".
2.) Engage in brief conversation; ask if military force is appropriate.
3.) When he says "No," ask, "Why not?"
4.) Wait until he says something to the effect of, "Because this would just cause a vicious circle of more innocent deaths, which would be awful and we should not cause more violence."
5.) When he's in mid sentence, punch him in the face as hard as you can.
6.) When he is about to punch you back, point out that it would be a serious mistake and contrary to his values to strike you, because that would "be awful and he should not cause more violence."
7.) Wait until he agrees that he has pledged not to commit additional violence.
8.) Punch him in the face again, harder this time. Repeat steps 5 through 8 until he understands that sometimes it is necessary to punch back.
Now I am not saying that those who hold peace as an underlying principle to their character are "ignorant" or "morons" etc. Indeed, it is these people that demonstrate that humanity still has potential and evolution is indeed slowly rolling along. I would say though, that at some points peace is simply not a viable option. This isn't knee jerk macho redneck bullshit either. Allow me to present you with a hypothetical:
You and your child are at the playground (and for the sake of this scenario you own a sidearm and have it in your possession) when some maniac, for whatever pathological reason (lets say he is evading law enforcement and they are near but haven't actually located said wackaloon) has decided he is going to do bodily harm to your child, possibly even killing your child. What are you going to do? Attempt reasoning? Perhaps, but I would imagine only in the context of if you knew that you had sufficient time to put the animal down before he could do the same to your child. Just an educated guess.
No sane person desires violence. Though those who are prepared for violence often fare much better than those who go looking for it.
In response to: "Halle-freakin-lujah brother! Time to stock up on ammo!"
I'm already covered.
risinglegion,
that's very insightful. I've thought about following your advice, but deep down inside of me, I know that I WILL BE HIT BACK IN THE FACE.
I understand truly what you are trying to say ---- if you encounter a kind, peaceful person, then "not fighting back" is the best approach. But if you face a Racist Zionist who has little resect for a "goyim" life, then you NEED to strike back as hard as you can and continue fighting for your life and self-respect.
You may ask, why would the kind peaceful person hit you? ---- say, I THIRD PERSON COMMITS AN AWEFUL FALSE FLAG (say hitting two sky-scrappers with jumbo jets), and the normally "kind and peaceful" person (this does NOT apply to many Americans, only the conscientious ones) is inflamed in anger and hatred ---- then they may hit you.
Anonymous said...
"1) The kids said "To NASRALLAH with love." (not to the Lebanese with love)
2) The kids were egged on by the AP photographer"
1) israeli kids just happened to be in an ammo dump during a war? [regardless of what they wrote..]
2) Like the dancing palestinians after 9/11? ... Oh wait, those were ISRAELIS......
Wed Jul 19, 05:43:54 PM EDT
We know who perpetuated the 9/11,so shut up.
You are a deadbolt with a broken cylinder.
risinglegion,
I completely agree with you that sometimes force is necessary to stop another unjust force, such as some sort of action against the person who is trying to do you and your child harm. I am not so much saying that there is no room for force, but I think the uncontrolled anger is where things get out of hand. This is how I see the difference between punitive justice and a justice system based on simply preventing harm being infilcted on others. Yes, I may take the sidearm and, if I'm a very good shot, hit the guy in the knee or something in order to incapacitate him. And the guy who's trying to do me harm will be stopped. If I were to then take it upon myself to be some sort of God-like judge and decide that it would be an appropriate punsishment to string him up by his feet and inflict pain on him for the next 6 months, this is going to an escalation, rather than simply preventing harm being done. It may even be necessary to lock this guy up or have him treated mentally if he's refusing to stop harming others, but when I take it upon myself to take revenge on him, that is where I see problems starting.
It seems very easy for me to sit here and talk about being calm in the face of adversity, when there are many who've lost much family or worse. But then there are people here who are just getting completely worked up in a hate-filled fever just reading the same stuff I am, so I don't know.
Any one of these groups or individuals who are warring with each other are in a dream world if they think that they're somehow going to 'wipe out' the other side.
http://statisticsoftheworld.page.tl
What the Hezbos are not cherishing their great victory? Isn't Al-Manar v braocasting from Haifa?
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